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Today's Topics:
1. Meeting @ KT On Saturday - Android Mail Client Expert!?
(Peter Hemmings)
2. Re: Meeting @ KT On Saturday - Android Mail Client Expert!?
(John Honniball)
3. Re: Meeting @ KT On Saturday - Android Mail Client Expert!?
(Chris)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2015 20:31:05 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: [bristol] Meeting @ KT On Saturday - Android Mail Client
Expert!?
Message-ID: <54EE3109.70604@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Just to remind newcomers (and lurkers), we have our usual, informal
meeting at the Knights Templer near Temple Meads Station this Saturday:
http://www.bristol.lug.org.uk/
If ther is an expert on using "K-9" or "MyMail" with multiple intends to
come, then beware I have some questions!
Hope to arrive around 2pm.
For newcomers, we try to sit in the corner of raised floor section at
the back, slightly to the left as you enter the bar.
Regards
--
Peter H
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2015 20:54:03 +0000
From: John Honniball <coredump@gifford.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Meeting @ KT On Saturday - Android Mail Client
Expert!?
Message-ID: <54EE366B.50200@gifford.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
On 25/02/2015 20:31, Peter Hemmings wrote:
> Just to remind newcomers (and lurkers), we have our usual, informal
> meeting at the Knights Templer near Temple Meads Station this Saturday:
I intend to attend!
> For newcomers, we try to sit in the corner of raised floor section at
> the back, slightly to the left as you enter the bar.
...because that's where the power sockets are!
--
John Honniball
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2015 22:41:41 +0100
From: Chris <cshorler@googlemail.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>,
John Honniball <coredump@gifford.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Meeting @ KT On Saturday - Android Mail Client
Expert!?
Message-ID: <C70211D5-05B5-4904-8698-E985C3EF25B4@googlemail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On 25 February 2015 21:54:03 CET, John Honniball <coredump@gifford.co.uk> wrote:
>On 25/02/2015 20:31, Peter Hemmings wrote:
>> Just to remind newcomers (and lurkers), we have our usual, informal
>> meeting at the Knights Templer near Temple Meads Station this
>Saturday:
>
>I intend to attend!
>
I'll attend!
>> For newcomers, we try to sit in the corner of raised floor section
>at
>> the back, slightly to the left as you enter the bar.
>
>...because that's where the power sockets are!
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 591, Issue 2
***************************************
Kamis, 26 Februari 2015
Selasa, 24 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 591, Issue 1
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: BT Profiling Slowed down my connection - OT (Amias Channer)
2. Re: Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2 (Amias Channer)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 15:58:04 +0000
From: Amias Channer <me@amias.net>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] BT Profiling Slowed down my connection - OT
Message-ID:
<CAMgU7XXWaTWzz0c=jAP9=Ny0hNV4bYNuTgQ2SePvHCjYqn_cDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hello Peter,
You do need to leave a device permenantly connected to an ADSL connection
to get the best speeds , the exchange uses a lot of power and doesn't want
to use power supplying lines that are not running so it optimises itself.
If you don't want to run wifi overnight you could just tell your router to
turn off wifi. Another option might be to use a separate ADSL modem (with
ethernet) and plug your router (with ethernet uplink) in to that and
ideally use a seperate AP with ethernet uplink, this would allow you to use
a timer plug to physically switch off the wifi but leave the adsl and rest
of the netwok up.
fwiw i leave wifi on all the time , i'd be suprised if it cost more than
10p per night. If you are worried about climate change (which we all should
be) then get your energy from a 100% renewable supplier like good energy ,
economically speaking the more renewable energy used the better.
Cheers
Amias
On 31 January 2015 at 15:18, Alex Butcher (LUG) <lug@assursys.co.uk> wrote:
> Eclipse have (characteristically) given you good info.
>
> If you want the gory details, start with <
> http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/DLM_system.htm> then read the rest of that
> site.
>
>
> On 31 January 2015 12:29:57 GMT+00:00, Peter Hemmings <
> peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have had some problems recently and would appreciate any info on
>> "profiling".
>>
>> Background:
>>
>> A month ago I fitted a new WiFi Router which I normally switch off at
>> night AND when not using it.
>> My normal download speed is about 5.2Mb/s and my synced speed of 5.9 but
>> last week I noticed the download was down to 3.2!
>> After doing the normal checks filter change/removing everything attached
>> and then testing from the "Line In" jack, Eclipse confirmed it was the
>> exchange that had throttled it back and I should leave it on 24/7.
>> After a couple of days my sync speed went up to 7.2 BUT I was still
>> getting 3.2 downloads!!
>> Eclipse then said that was correct as there was still a limit on the
>> line and they would request a "profile reset" but I should wait 24
>> hours for it to "learn" the line and increase the speed.
>>
>>
>>
>> My download speed has now increased
>> to about 6.5 which is as good as I
>> have ever had, but I was wondering if others had experience/knowledge
>> of profiling, in particular, is it really necessary to have the router
>> on 24/7 or is it OK just to switch it off a night?
>>
>> Also, why was there a need to reset my profile to increase download
>> speeds if I had the router on 24/7 !?
>>
>> I was also informed that BT's new exchange S/W cannot tell the
>> difference between a faulty line and switching off the router, so if
>> its switched on and off a few times during the day, download speeds
>> will reduce.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
> --
> Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
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------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 16:25:41 +0000
From: Amias Channer <me@amias.net>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
Message-ID:
<CAMgU7XVeB31eWmyL3CTJM0hgAWvqWPy+2cRC2aKtuj7NaAJtGA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hello Luggers,
+1 for samsung SDD's , intel ones are also good.
I work for a company that makes virtualised storage systems , i do testing
and the only non enterprise SDD's that proved reliable enough where samsung
and intel. If you want solid and fast look at drives using the sandforce
chipsets/firmware or checkout the fusionio offerings but you will need to
be seated when you read the price.
You must always have backups of SDD storage as it is just not as reliable
as HDD.
Personally i would build the system so that all live storage is SDD using
LVM then have it periodically copy snapshots to HDD that is unmounted at
all other times. The raw speed and silence of SDDs will ruin HDD's for you.
Also if you are doing audio work SDD makes much less electrical noise on
the system soundcard , this might also be an issue if you are doing complex
electronics with or near the computer.
RAID'ing SDD is mostly pointless unless you have some really big iron and
enterprise type data throughput requirements , there are some interesting
solutions that provide hybrid SDD/HDD storage but none of them feel
anything like as quick as an SDD. Most RAID is designed around fixing the
problems with spinning disks.
Cheers
Amias
On 3 February 2015 at 14:56, Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk> wrote:
> On Tue, 3 Feb 2015, Fergus Allan wrote:
>
> SSD's have been incredibly unreliable. Either dirty pages returned or
>> complete failure.
>>
>> I've had 2 crucial SSD's, both failed totally at 3 months old; little red
>> light comes on and no access to any part of the disk. The first also
>> returned dirty pages pretty much from day 1. I've haven't fixed all my
>> corrupted data from that issue. That was a few years ago. We were
>> discussing ordering some SSDs at work and I suggested Crucial even though
>> I
>> don't trust their devices, expecting a positive reaction, but they shot
>> that down as too unreliable.
>>
>
> But of course you've got backups you can restore from, right?!?
>
> We make extensive use of SSDs in our centralised storage at work, with no
> particular problems. But, of course, we'll almost certainly be using
> enterprise kit rather than consumer stuff.
>
> When choosing an SSD for a new desktop, amongst the consumer stuff, the
> Samsung 850 PRO SSDs struck me as having appreciably better longevity
> ratings (150TBW for the 128GB and 256GB models, 300TBW for the 512GB and
> 1TB) than most others and with a warranty (10 years) to match.
>
> <http://www.storagereview.com/demystifying_ssd_endurance>
>
> Personally, I still rely on (spinning rust) hard drives in RAID1 for
> storing
> data that's at all important. The SSD is purely to improve responsiveness
> of
> the OS and key applications, and it is backed up regularly to a RAID1 array
> (or it will be, when I get round to it!)
>
> OCZ went bust and was bought out and the brand name retained. As far as I
>> can tell, OCZ makes crucial look good for reliability.
>>
>> 22 years? Not a chance. 3 maybe and back up often.
>>
>
> That depends on the figure for maximum write volume (in TBW) and what your
> write activity is like. For an SSD to last 22 years in a "normal
> workstation" (<http://ssdendurancetest.com/>) requires specifying for
> 10-20GB/day of writes, or 80.3-160.6TBW. Only a dozen or so drives from the
> two manufacturers you name are rated for over 100TBW:
> <http://skinflint.co.uk/?cat=hdssd&xf=1035_OCZ~1035_
> Crucial~4930_100#xf_top>.
>
> I'm toying with using SSD's again, but can't quite trust them unless I
>> raid
>> them.
>>
>
> TBH, I haven't trusted un-mirrored HDDs since 2002.
>
> Fergus.
>>
>
> Best Regards,
> Alex
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
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------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 591, Issue 1
***************************************
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
bristol-request@mailman.lug.org.uk
You can reach the person managing the list at
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: BT Profiling Slowed down my connection - OT (Amias Channer)
2. Re: Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2 (Amias Channer)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 15:58:04 +0000
From: Amias Channer <me@amias.net>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] BT Profiling Slowed down my connection - OT
Message-ID:
<CAMgU7XXWaTWzz0c=jAP9=Ny0hNV4bYNuTgQ2SePvHCjYqn_cDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hello Peter,
You do need to leave a device permenantly connected to an ADSL connection
to get the best speeds , the exchange uses a lot of power and doesn't want
to use power supplying lines that are not running so it optimises itself.
If you don't want to run wifi overnight you could just tell your router to
turn off wifi. Another option might be to use a separate ADSL modem (with
ethernet) and plug your router (with ethernet uplink) in to that and
ideally use a seperate AP with ethernet uplink, this would allow you to use
a timer plug to physically switch off the wifi but leave the adsl and rest
of the netwok up.
fwiw i leave wifi on all the time , i'd be suprised if it cost more than
10p per night. If you are worried about climate change (which we all should
be) then get your energy from a 100% renewable supplier like good energy ,
economically speaking the more renewable energy used the better.
Cheers
Amias
On 31 January 2015 at 15:18, Alex Butcher (LUG) <lug@assursys.co.uk> wrote:
> Eclipse have (characteristically) given you good info.
>
> If you want the gory details, start with <
> http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/DLM_system.htm> then read the rest of that
> site.
>
>
> On 31 January 2015 12:29:57 GMT+00:00, Peter Hemmings <
> peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have had some problems recently and would appreciate any info on
>> "profiling".
>>
>> Background:
>>
>> A month ago I fitted a new WiFi Router which I normally switch off at
>> night AND when not using it.
>> My normal download speed is about 5.2Mb/s and my synced speed of 5.9 but
>> last week I noticed the download was down to 3.2!
>> After doing the normal checks filter change/removing everything attached
>> and then testing from the "Line In" jack, Eclipse confirmed it was the
>> exchange that had throttled it back and I should leave it on 24/7.
>> After a couple of days my sync speed went up to 7.2 BUT I was still
>> getting 3.2 downloads!!
>> Eclipse then said that was correct as there was still a limit on the
>> line and they would request a "profile reset" but I should wait 24
>> hours for it to "learn" the line and increase the speed.
>>
>>
>>
>> My download speed has now increased
>> to about 6.5 which is as good as I
>> have ever had, but I was wondering if others had experience/knowledge
>> of profiling, in particular, is it really necessary to have the router
>> on 24/7 or is it OK just to switch it off a night?
>>
>> Also, why was there a need to reset my profile to increase download
>> speeds if I had the router on 24/7 !?
>>
>> I was also informed that BT's new exchange S/W cannot tell the
>> difference between a faulty line and switching off the router, so if
>> its switched on and off a few times during the day, download speeds
>> will reduce.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
> --
> Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
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------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 16:25:41 +0000
From: Amias Channer <me@amias.net>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
Message-ID:
<CAMgU7XVeB31eWmyL3CTJM0hgAWvqWPy+2cRC2aKtuj7NaAJtGA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hello Luggers,
+1 for samsung SDD's , intel ones are also good.
I work for a company that makes virtualised storage systems , i do testing
and the only non enterprise SDD's that proved reliable enough where samsung
and intel. If you want solid and fast look at drives using the sandforce
chipsets/firmware or checkout the fusionio offerings but you will need to
be seated when you read the price.
You must always have backups of SDD storage as it is just not as reliable
as HDD.
Personally i would build the system so that all live storage is SDD using
LVM then have it periodically copy snapshots to HDD that is unmounted at
all other times. The raw speed and silence of SDDs will ruin HDD's for you.
Also if you are doing audio work SDD makes much less electrical noise on
the system soundcard , this might also be an issue if you are doing complex
electronics with or near the computer.
RAID'ing SDD is mostly pointless unless you have some really big iron and
enterprise type data throughput requirements , there are some interesting
solutions that provide hybrid SDD/HDD storage but none of them feel
anything like as quick as an SDD. Most RAID is designed around fixing the
problems with spinning disks.
Cheers
Amias
On 3 February 2015 at 14:56, Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk> wrote:
> On Tue, 3 Feb 2015, Fergus Allan wrote:
>
> SSD's have been incredibly unreliable. Either dirty pages returned or
>> complete failure.
>>
>> I've had 2 crucial SSD's, both failed totally at 3 months old; little red
>> light comes on and no access to any part of the disk. The first also
>> returned dirty pages pretty much from day 1. I've haven't fixed all my
>> corrupted data from that issue. That was a few years ago. We were
>> discussing ordering some SSDs at work and I suggested Crucial even though
>> I
>> don't trust their devices, expecting a positive reaction, but they shot
>> that down as too unreliable.
>>
>
> But of course you've got backups you can restore from, right?!?
>
> We make extensive use of SSDs in our centralised storage at work, with no
> particular problems. But, of course, we'll almost certainly be using
> enterprise kit rather than consumer stuff.
>
> When choosing an SSD for a new desktop, amongst the consumer stuff, the
> Samsung 850 PRO SSDs struck me as having appreciably better longevity
> ratings (150TBW for the 128GB and 256GB models, 300TBW for the 512GB and
> 1TB) than most others and with a warranty (10 years) to match.
>
> <http://www.storagereview.com/demystifying_ssd_endurance>
>
> Personally, I still rely on (spinning rust) hard drives in RAID1 for
> storing
> data that's at all important. The SSD is purely to improve responsiveness
> of
> the OS and key applications, and it is backed up regularly to a RAID1 array
> (or it will be, when I get round to it!)
>
> OCZ went bust and was bought out and the brand name retained. As far as I
>> can tell, OCZ makes crucial look good for reliability.
>>
>> 22 years? Not a chance. 3 maybe and back up often.
>>
>
> That depends on the figure for maximum write volume (in TBW) and what your
> write activity is like. For an SSD to last 22 years in a "normal
> workstation" (<http://ssdendurancetest.com/>) requires specifying for
> 10-20GB/day of writes, or 80.3-160.6TBW. Only a dozen or so drives from the
> two manufacturers you name are rated for over 100TBW:
> <http://skinflint.co.uk/?cat=hdssd&xf=1035_OCZ~1035_
> Crucial~4930_100#xf_top>.
>
> I'm toying with using SSD's again, but can't quite trust them unless I
>> raid
>> them.
>>
>
> TBH, I haven't trusted un-mirrored HDDs since 2002.
>
> Fergus.
>>
>
> Best Regards,
> Alex
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
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------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 591, Issue 1
***************************************
Jumat, 20 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 4
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
bristol-request@mailman.lug.org.uk
You can reach the person managing the list at
bristol-owner@mailman.lug.org.uk
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: OT: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Chris)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 23:03:03 +0000
From: Chris <cshorler@googlemail.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>,
David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
Subject: Re: [bristol] OT: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <7C0AA90C-FE76-411C-BADE-5B500089FCA7@googlemail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On 19 February 2015 10:11:59 GMT+00:00, David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com> wrote:
>> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk
>[mailto:bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Alex Butcher
>> <http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/>
>
>"Outlook-Quotefix does not (yet) work with Outlook 2007"
>
>Let alone LookOut 2010 that I have to run...
>
What's the alternative?
I'd welcome a viable alternative to Outlook email (work, not by choice). Quoting is the least of my problems when every other person in the conversation is an Outlook user. I can't imagine they've ever seen better.
Frequently paging through the conversation is wasteful when there's no good way to reduce context to concise levels for viewing. Topic folders are easier to use than categories, and categories seem not to persist through responses (despite being potentially more useful for multi topic indexing). Outlook conversation searches seem broken 50% of the time when subject matches still succeed. One key use is to search things sent years ago, really only practical with a rigid approach to organisation. Exporting mail and calendars - nothing works well for me - I've had several partial successes, nothing which would allow me to practically restore the export folders.
Never mind the idea of linked topics within categories. Not to mention ancient task management / archival, calendar archival, auto switch to rich text on receive format. Wiki export... etc.
Where's the radical new forward thinking information tool for Linux... or Windows?
Chris
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 4
***************************************
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To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: OT: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Chris)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 23:03:03 +0000
From: Chris <cshorler@googlemail.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>,
David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
Subject: Re: [bristol] OT: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <7C0AA90C-FE76-411C-BADE-5B500089FCA7@googlemail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On 19 February 2015 10:11:59 GMT+00:00, David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com> wrote:
>> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk
>[mailto:bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Alex Butcher
>> <http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/>
>
>"Outlook-Quotefix does not (yet) work with Outlook 2007"
>
>Let alone LookOut 2010 that I have to run...
>
What's the alternative?
I'd welcome a viable alternative to Outlook email (work, not by choice). Quoting is the least of my problems when every other person in the conversation is an Outlook user. I can't imagine they've ever seen better.
Frequently paging through the conversation is wasteful when there's no good way to reduce context to concise levels for viewing. Topic folders are easier to use than categories, and categories seem not to persist through responses (despite being potentially more useful for multi topic indexing). Outlook conversation searches seem broken 50% of the time when subject matches still succeed. One key use is to search things sent years ago, really only practical with a rigid approach to organisation. Exporting mail and calendars - nothing works well for me - I've had several partial successes, nothing which would allow me to practically restore the export folders.
Never mind the idea of linked topics within categories. Not to mention ancient task management / archival, calendar archival, auto switch to rich text on receive format. Wiki export... etc.
Where's the radical new forward thinking information tool for Linux... or Windows?
Chris
------------------------------
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https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 4
***************************************
Kamis, 19 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 3
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
2. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Alex Butcher)
3. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 08:49:10 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B389@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Keith Edmunds
> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:25:20 +0000, David.Smith@imgtec.com said:
> > top-posting (which I blame on having to use LookOut which pretty much
> > forces you to top-post)
>
> Workman, tools...
You might say that, but it's true. Unless you forcibly switch it to plain text mode on every mail, you cannot bottom-post. It's not just a case of scrolling down and putting the cursor at the bottom. Anything added within or below the quoted text is considered as part of the quoted text, which is even more confusing. I normally remember to bottom-post for BBLUG mails (including jumping through LookOut's stupid hoops to allow me to do so), but this time I forgot. So sue me.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 10:04:55 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502191004310.7509@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Thu, 19 Feb 2015, David Smith wrote:
>> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
>> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Keith Edmunds
>> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:25:20 +0000, David.Smith@imgtec.com said:
>>> top-posting (which I blame on having to use LookOut which pretty much
>>> forces you to top-post)
>>
>> Workman, tools...
>
> You might say that, but it's true. Unless you forcibly switch it to plain
> text mode on every mail, you cannot bottom-post.
<http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/>
Best Regards,
Alex
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 10:11:59 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B402@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Alex Butcher
> <http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/>
"Outlook-Quotefix does not (yet) work with Outlook 2007"
Let alone LookOut 2010 that I have to run...
------------------------------
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End of Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 3
***************************************
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
2. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Alex Butcher)
3. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 08:49:10 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B389@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Keith Edmunds
> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:25:20 +0000, David.Smith@imgtec.com said:
> > top-posting (which I blame on having to use LookOut which pretty much
> > forces you to top-post)
>
> Workman, tools...
You might say that, but it's true. Unless you forcibly switch it to plain text mode on every mail, you cannot bottom-post. It's not just a case of scrolling down and putting the cursor at the bottom. Anything added within or below the quoted text is considered as part of the quoted text, which is even more confusing. I normally remember to bottom-post for BBLUG mails (including jumping through LookOut's stupid hoops to allow me to do so), but this time I forgot. So sue me.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 10:04:55 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502191004310.7509@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Thu, 19 Feb 2015, David Smith wrote:
>> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
>> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Keith Edmunds
>> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:25:20 +0000, David.Smith@imgtec.com said:
>>> top-posting (which I blame on having to use LookOut which pretty much
>>> forces you to top-post)
>>
>> Workman, tools...
>
> You might say that, but it's true. Unless you forcibly switch it to plain
> text mode on every mail, you cannot bottom-post.
<http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/>
Best Regards,
Alex
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 10:11:59 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B402@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Alex Butcher
> <http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/>
"Outlook-Quotefix does not (yet) work with Outlook 2007"
Let alone LookOut 2010 that I have to run...
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 3
***************************************
Rabu, 18 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 2
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
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or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Peter Hemmings)
2. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
3. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Steve King)
4. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
(Andy Pepperdine (BBLUG account))
5. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Alex Butcher)
6. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Peter Hemmings)
7. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Keith Edmunds)
8. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Peter Hemmings)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 15:06:27 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E4AA73.7010507@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Ithink I will give up for a while!, been trying for nearly 3 hours,
changed passwords set up 2 step OK but still K-9 fails to send and still
insists I have a wrong password/username.
When I repeat the setup in K-9 (sending), it tries to verify the server
and come back with:
"Username or password incorrect.(AUTH PLAIN failed (Negative SMTP
reply:535 5.7.8
http://support.google.com/mail/bin/answer.py?answer=4257hj10sm20383607wjc.48
- gsmtp))"
Can this only meen I still have a typo!!?
On 18/02/15 10:20, Alex Butcher wrote:
> For Peter:
>
> I think this should work - configure the Outgoing Server in K-9 for your
> *Eclipse* account to be:
>
> server: smtp.googlemail.com
> security: SSL/TLS
> port: 465
> require sign-in: tick
> username: yourgoogleusername@googlemail.com
> authentication: normal password
> password: yourgooglepassword (or an application-specific password
> <https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en> if
> you're using Google 2-Step Verification
> <https://www.google.com/landing/2step/> - which, incidentally, I
> *strongly* recommend, albeit at the cost of a bit more complexity)
>
> Assuming, of course, that the telco whose network you're roaming on doesn't
> block SMTPS connections!
>
> Best Regards,
> Alex
I Can still send via my new passworded gmail account!
Regards
--
Peter H
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 15:11:40 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B2D5@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
> I think I will give up for a while!, been trying for nearly 3 hours, changed
> passwords set up 2 step OK but still K-9 fails to send and still insists I have a
> wrong password/username.
This link:
http://www.minertechsolutions.com/blogs/how-to-configure-your-android-phone-with-gmail-using-k-9-mail-more/
Says:
SMTP server: smtp.gmail.com
Security Type: TLS (always)
Port: 587
Check the "Require Sign-in." box
Authentication type: PLAIN
Username: email@domain.com
Password: yourPassword
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 15:52:41 -0000
From: "Steve King" <debian@invux.com>
To: "Bristol and Bath Linux User Group" <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<d7a9a61506de0d49f304581cd8760a0a.squirrel@dazzle.invux.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, David Smith wrote:
>
>> I'm using the same (K9 with Eclipse); I'll have a look at my phone
>> settings.
>>
>> One thing to remember - Eclipse's outgoing SMTP server rejects mails if
>> you're not contacting it via your Eclipse broadband connection.
>> Therefore, you can only send outgoing mails when you're actually at home
>> (or maybe routing via home through a VPN).
>
> Actually, it appears to go a step further and drop SMTP connection
> requests
> from outside their customer network!
>
> For Peter:
>
> I think this should work - configure the Outgoing Server in K-9 for your
> *Eclipse* account to be:
>
> server: smtp.googlemail.com
> security: SSL/TLS
> port: 465
> require sign-in: tick
> username: yourgoogleusername@googlemail.com
> authentication: normal password
> password: yourgooglepassword (or an application-specific password
> <https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en> if
> you're using Google 2-Step Verification
> <https://www.google.com/landing/2step/> - which, incidentally, I
> *strongly* recommend, albeit at the cost of a bit more complexity)
>
> Assuming, of course, that the telco whose network you're roaming on
> doesn't
> block SMTPS connections!
>
> Best Regards,
> Alex
>
Isn't best practice to use TLS via port 587? (RFC 6409)
It is designed as a first hop for email clients.
Port 465 is 'deprecated'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMTPS
--
Steve
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 16:01:14 +0000
From: "Andy Pepperdine (BBLUG account)" <bbl.andy@pepsplace.org.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E4B74A.90706@pepsplace.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
On 18/02/15 15:06, Peter Hemmings wrote:
> Ithink I will give up for a while!, been trying for nearly 3 hours,
> changed passwords set up 2 step OK but still K-9 fails to send and still
> insists I have a wrong password/username.
Peter, check your port numbers. SSL is on 465, STARTTLS is on 587. See:
https://support.google.com/mail/answer/1074635?hl=en
Andy
>
> When I repeat the setup in K-9 (sending), it tries to verify the server
> and come back with:
>
> "Username or password incorrect.(AUTH PLAIN failed (Negative SMTP
> reply:535 5.7.8
> http://support.google.com/mail/bin/answer.py?answer=4257hj10sm20383607wjc.48
> - gsmtp))"
>
> Can this only meen I still have a typo!!?
>
>
> On 18/02/15 10:20, Alex Butcher wrote:
>> For Peter:
>>
>> I think this should work - configure the Outgoing Server in K-9 for your
>> *Eclipse* account to be:
>>
>> server: smtp.googlemail.com
>> security: SSL/TLS
>> port: 465
>> require sign-in: tick
>> username: yourgoogleusername@googlemail.com
>> authentication: normal password
>> password: yourgooglepassword (or an application-specific password
>> <https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en> if
>> you're using Google 2-Step Verification
>> <https://www.google.com/landing/2step/> - which, incidentally, I
>> *strongly* recommend, albeit at the cost of a bit more complexity)
>>
>> Assuming, of course, that the telco whose network you're roaming on
>> doesn't
>> block SMTPS connections!
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Alex
>
> I Can still send via my new passworded gmail account!
>
> Regards
--
Andy Pepperdine
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 16:04:49 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: debian@invux.com, Bristol and Bath Linux User Group
<bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502181558470.4292@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, Steve King wrote:
[...]
>> server: smtp.googlemail.com
>> security: SSL/TLS
>> port: 465
[...]
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Alex
>>
>
> Isn't best practice to use TLS via port 587? (RFC 6409)
> It is designed as a first hop for email clients.
> Port 465 is 'deprecated'
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMTPS
I seem to recall (when I set up K-9 back in 2010), it did like Thunderbird
does and looked up mail providers' settings from an online database based on
the domain name. It worked, and has continued to work, so my settings file
has moved from device to device without modification since then.
So, quite possibly...
<https://support.google.com/mail/answer/78775?hl=en> seems to be the most
official page on Google's SMTP service that I can find.
> Steve
Best Regards,
Alex
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 16:53:30 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E4C38A.5040909@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Thanks for the info (been out).
I did find the info on different using port 587 which I tried before
posting, but that did not work either.
I will have another go later after reading links and redouble checks for
typos!
On 18/02/15 16:04, Alex Butcher wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, Steve King wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>>> server: smtp.googlemail.com
>>> security: SSL/TLS
>>> port: 465
>
> [...]
>
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>> Alex
>>>
>>
>> Isn't best practice to use TLS via port 587? (RFC 6409)
>> It is designed as a first hop for email clients.
>> Port 465 is 'deprecated'
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMTPS
>
> I seem to recall (when I set up K-9 back in 2010), it did like Thunderbird
> does and looked up mail providers' settings from an online database
> based on
> the domain name. It worked, and has continued to work, so my settings file
> has moved from device to device without modification since then.
>
> So, quite possibly...
>
> <https://support.google.com/mail/answer/78775?hl=en> seems to be the most
> official page on Google's SMTP service that I can find.
>
>> Steve
>
> Best Regards,
> Alex
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
Regards
--
Peter H
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 21:25:45 +0000
From: Keith Edmunds <kae@midnighthax.com>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <20150218212545.1d515b6b@ws.the.cage>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:25:20 +0000, David.Smith@imgtec.com said:
> top-posting (which I blame on having to use LookOut which pretty much
> forces you to top-post)
Workman, tools...
--
"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't" - Jack Dempsey
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 00:36:51 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E53023.4090504@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
On 18/02/15 16:04, Alex Butcher wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, Steve King wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>>> server: smtp.googlemail.com
>>> security: SSL/TLS
>>> port: 465
I have now spent over 10 hours with different combinations and must give
up for a while!
I checked on 2 step but that needed me to generate another password for
K-9 (using my laptop) which still did not work so switched it off as it
was just another layer of likely problems.
Back to being able to send by gmail and not K-9, BTW I did change
server: smtp.gmail.com but that did not work either.
Will try later this week.
>
> [...]
>
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>> Alex
>>>
PS just a thought as I was finishing, could this problem caused by my
lan router or should I only be using this through my mobile network!?
(straws and clutching seem to be relevant here)
--
Peter H
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 2
***************************************
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To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
bristol-owner@mailman.lug.org.uk
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Peter Hemmings)
2. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
3. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Steve King)
4. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
(Andy Pepperdine (BBLUG account))
5. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Alex Butcher)
6. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Peter Hemmings)
7. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Keith Edmunds)
8. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Peter Hemmings)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 15:06:27 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E4AA73.7010507@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Ithink I will give up for a while!, been trying for nearly 3 hours,
changed passwords set up 2 step OK but still K-9 fails to send and still
insists I have a wrong password/username.
When I repeat the setup in K-9 (sending), it tries to verify the server
and come back with:
"Username or password incorrect.(AUTH PLAIN failed (Negative SMTP
reply:535 5.7.8
http://support.google.com/mail/bin/answer.py?answer=4257hj10sm20383607wjc.48
- gsmtp))"
Can this only meen I still have a typo!!?
On 18/02/15 10:20, Alex Butcher wrote:
> For Peter:
>
> I think this should work - configure the Outgoing Server in K-9 for your
> *Eclipse* account to be:
>
> server: smtp.googlemail.com
> security: SSL/TLS
> port: 465
> require sign-in: tick
> username: yourgoogleusername@googlemail.com
> authentication: normal password
> password: yourgooglepassword (or an application-specific password
> <https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en> if
> you're using Google 2-Step Verification
> <https://www.google.com/landing/2step/> - which, incidentally, I
> *strongly* recommend, albeit at the cost of a bit more complexity)
>
> Assuming, of course, that the telco whose network you're roaming on doesn't
> block SMTPS connections!
>
> Best Regards,
> Alex
I Can still send via my new passworded gmail account!
Regards
--
Peter H
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 15:11:40 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B2D5@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
> I think I will give up for a while!, been trying for nearly 3 hours, changed
> passwords set up 2 step OK but still K-9 fails to send and still insists I have a
> wrong password/username.
This link:
http://www.minertechsolutions.com/blogs/how-to-configure-your-android-phone-with-gmail-using-k-9-mail-more/
Says:
SMTP server: smtp.gmail.com
Security Type: TLS (always)
Port: 587
Check the "Require Sign-in." box
Authentication type: PLAIN
Username: email@domain.com
Password: yourPassword
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 15:52:41 -0000
From: "Steve King" <debian@invux.com>
To: "Bristol and Bath Linux User Group" <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<d7a9a61506de0d49f304581cd8760a0a.squirrel@dazzle.invux.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, David Smith wrote:
>
>> I'm using the same (K9 with Eclipse); I'll have a look at my phone
>> settings.
>>
>> One thing to remember - Eclipse's outgoing SMTP server rejects mails if
>> you're not contacting it via your Eclipse broadband connection.
>> Therefore, you can only send outgoing mails when you're actually at home
>> (or maybe routing via home through a VPN).
>
> Actually, it appears to go a step further and drop SMTP connection
> requests
> from outside their customer network!
>
> For Peter:
>
> I think this should work - configure the Outgoing Server in K-9 for your
> *Eclipse* account to be:
>
> server: smtp.googlemail.com
> security: SSL/TLS
> port: 465
> require sign-in: tick
> username: yourgoogleusername@googlemail.com
> authentication: normal password
> password: yourgooglepassword (or an application-specific password
> <https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en> if
> you're using Google 2-Step Verification
> <https://www.google.com/landing/2step/> - which, incidentally, I
> *strongly* recommend, albeit at the cost of a bit more complexity)
>
> Assuming, of course, that the telco whose network you're roaming on
> doesn't
> block SMTPS connections!
>
> Best Regards,
> Alex
>
Isn't best practice to use TLS via port 587? (RFC 6409)
It is designed as a first hop for email clients.
Port 465 is 'deprecated'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMTPS
--
Steve
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 16:01:14 +0000
From: "Andy Pepperdine (BBLUG account)" <bbl.andy@pepsplace.org.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E4B74A.90706@pepsplace.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
On 18/02/15 15:06, Peter Hemmings wrote:
> Ithink I will give up for a while!, been trying for nearly 3 hours,
> changed passwords set up 2 step OK but still K-9 fails to send and still
> insists I have a wrong password/username.
Peter, check your port numbers. SSL is on 465, STARTTLS is on 587. See:
https://support.google.com/mail/answer/1074635?hl=en
Andy
>
> When I repeat the setup in K-9 (sending), it tries to verify the server
> and come back with:
>
> "Username or password incorrect.(AUTH PLAIN failed (Negative SMTP
> reply:535 5.7.8
> http://support.google.com/mail/bin/answer.py?answer=4257hj10sm20383607wjc.48
> - gsmtp))"
>
> Can this only meen I still have a typo!!?
>
>
> On 18/02/15 10:20, Alex Butcher wrote:
>> For Peter:
>>
>> I think this should work - configure the Outgoing Server in K-9 for your
>> *Eclipse* account to be:
>>
>> server: smtp.googlemail.com
>> security: SSL/TLS
>> port: 465
>> require sign-in: tick
>> username: yourgoogleusername@googlemail.com
>> authentication: normal password
>> password: yourgooglepassword (or an application-specific password
>> <https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en> if
>> you're using Google 2-Step Verification
>> <https://www.google.com/landing/2step/> - which, incidentally, I
>> *strongly* recommend, albeit at the cost of a bit more complexity)
>>
>> Assuming, of course, that the telco whose network you're roaming on
>> doesn't
>> block SMTPS connections!
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Alex
>
> I Can still send via my new passworded gmail account!
>
> Regards
--
Andy Pepperdine
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 16:04:49 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: debian@invux.com, Bristol and Bath Linux User Group
<bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502181558470.4292@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, Steve King wrote:
[...]
>> server: smtp.googlemail.com
>> security: SSL/TLS
>> port: 465
[...]
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Alex
>>
>
> Isn't best practice to use TLS via port 587? (RFC 6409)
> It is designed as a first hop for email clients.
> Port 465 is 'deprecated'
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMTPS
I seem to recall (when I set up K-9 back in 2010), it did like Thunderbird
does and looked up mail providers' settings from an online database based on
the domain name. It worked, and has continued to work, so my settings file
has moved from device to device without modification since then.
So, quite possibly...
<https://support.google.com/mail/answer/78775?hl=en> seems to be the most
official page on Google's SMTP service that I can find.
> Steve
Best Regards,
Alex
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 16:53:30 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E4C38A.5040909@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Thanks for the info (been out).
I did find the info on different using port 587 which I tried before
posting, but that did not work either.
I will have another go later after reading links and redouble checks for
typos!
On 18/02/15 16:04, Alex Butcher wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, Steve King wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>>> server: smtp.googlemail.com
>>> security: SSL/TLS
>>> port: 465
>
> [...]
>
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>> Alex
>>>
>>
>> Isn't best practice to use TLS via port 587? (RFC 6409)
>> It is designed as a first hop for email clients.
>> Port 465 is 'deprecated'
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMTPS
>
> I seem to recall (when I set up K-9 back in 2010), it did like Thunderbird
> does and looked up mail providers' settings from an online database
> based on
> the domain name. It worked, and has continued to work, so my settings file
> has moved from device to device without modification since then.
>
> So, quite possibly...
>
> <https://support.google.com/mail/answer/78775?hl=en> seems to be the most
> official page on Google's SMTP service that I can find.
>
>> Steve
>
> Best Regards,
> Alex
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
Regards
--
Peter H
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 21:25:45 +0000
From: Keith Edmunds <kae@midnighthax.com>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <20150218212545.1d515b6b@ws.the.cage>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:25:20 +0000, David.Smith@imgtec.com said:
> top-posting (which I blame on having to use LookOut which pretty much
> forces you to top-post)
Workman, tools...
--
"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't" - Jack Dempsey
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 00:36:51 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E53023.4090504@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
On 18/02/15 16:04, Alex Butcher wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, Steve King wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>>> server: smtp.googlemail.com
>>> security: SSL/TLS
>>> port: 465
I have now spent over 10 hours with different combinations and must give
up for a while!
I checked on 2 step but that needed me to generate another password for
K-9 (using my laptop) which still did not work so switched it off as it
was just another layer of likely problems.
Back to being able to send by gmail and not K-9, BTW I did change
server: smtp.gmail.com but that did not work either.
Will try later this week.
>
> [...]
>
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>> Alex
>>>
PS just a thought as I was finishing, could this problem caused by my
lan router or should I only be using this through my mobile network!?
(straws and clutching seem to be relevant here)
--
Peter H
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 2
***************************************
Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 1
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Peter Hemmings)
2. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
3. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (david)
4. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Alex Butcher)
5. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:06:22 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E4641E.7080207@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Hi,
I am still catching up with this new world of Smartphones!
I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried
sending mail!
Whilst on holiday I tried to send "wish you were here" messages and it
refused to connect to Eclipses smtp server which I had set and thought I
had settings incorrect!
After a quick call to my ISP I realized I could not send through my ISP
but was told I could easily set up K-9 to post via my gmail account and
receive from eclipse.
Unfortunately I cannot find where the smtp settings are for "Mail" on
the Android but did a bit of googling and found some information however
it still will not send via my gmail account. I can send a message from
the "Mail" app to my eclipse account but would like to do it from my
normal K-9 app on the phone.
FYI on my K-9 > settings > Account settings > Sending mail > Outgoing
server I have:
smtp server - smtp.gmail.com
Security - SSL/TLS
Port - 587
Requiring sign-in is ticked
Any help to get this to work would be appreciated.
Regards
--
Peter H
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:09:14 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B1E7@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I'm using the same (K9 with Eclipse); I'll have a look at my phone settings.
One thing to remember - Eclipse's outgoing SMTP server rejects mails if you're not contacting it via your Eclipse broadband connection. Therefore, you can only send outgoing mails when you're actually at home (or maybe routing via home through a VPN).
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
> Sent: 18 February 2015 10:06
> To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group
> Subject: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
>
> Hi,
>
> I am still catching up with this new world of Smartphones!
>
> I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
> several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried sending
> mail!
>
> Whilst on holiday I tried to send "wish you were here" messages and it
> refused to connect to Eclipses smtp server which I had set and thought I had
> settings incorrect!
>
> After a quick call to my ISP I realized I could not send through my ISP but was
> told I could easily set up K-9 to post via my gmail account and receive from
> eclipse.
>
> Unfortunately I cannot find where the smtp settings are for "Mail" on the
> Android but did a bit of googling and found some information however it still
> will not send via my gmail account. I can send a message from the "Mail" app
> to my eclipse account but would like to do it from my normal K-9 app on the
> phone.
>
> FYI on my K-9 > settings > Account settings > Sending mail > Outgoing server I
> have:
>
> smtp server - smtp.gmail.com
> Security - SSL/TLS
> Port - 587
> Requiring sign-in is ticked
>
> Any help to get this to work would be appreciated.
>
> Regards
>
> --
> Peter H
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:14:32 +0000
From: david <david@avoncliff.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E46608.9020809@avoncliff.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
On 18/02/15 10:09, David Smith wrote:
> I'm using the same (K9 with Eclipse); I'll have a look at my phone settings.
>
> One thing to remember - Eclipse's outgoing SMTP server rejects mails if you're not contacting it via your Eclipse broadband connection. Therefore, you can only send outgoing mails when you're actually at home (or maybe routing via home through a VPN).
>
A problem I have had when away from home is hotels and other wi-fi
filtering email ports. Nothing standard, some times it works, sometimes
you can get round it, worst case resort to web mail.
David
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
>> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
>> Sent: 18 February 2015 10:06
>> To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group
>> Subject: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am still catching up with this new world of Smartphones!
>>
>> I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
>> several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried sending
>> mail!
>>
>> Whilst on holiday I tried to send "wish you were here" messages and it
>> refused to connect to Eclipses smtp server which I had set and thought I had
>> settings incorrect!
>>
>> After a quick call to my ISP I realized I could not send through my ISP but was
>> told I could easily set up K-9 to post via my gmail account and receive from
>> eclipse.
>>
>> Unfortunately I cannot find where the smtp settings are for "Mail" on the
>> Android but did a bit of googling and found some information however it still
>> will not send via my gmail account. I can send a message from the "Mail" app
>> to my eclipse account but would like to do it from my normal K-9 app on the
>> phone.
>>
>> FYI on my K-9 > settings > Account settings > Sending mail > Outgoing server I
>> have:
>>
>> smtp server - smtp.gmail.com
>> Security - SSL/TLS
>> Port - 587
>> Requiring sign-in is ticked
>>
>> Any help to get this to work would be appreciated.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> --
>> Peter H
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Bristol mailing list
>> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:20:26 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502181014400.4292@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, David Smith wrote:
> I'm using the same (K9 with Eclipse); I'll have a look at my phone settings.
>
> One thing to remember - Eclipse's outgoing SMTP server rejects mails if you're not contacting it via your Eclipse broadband connection. Therefore, you can only send outgoing mails when you're actually at home (or maybe routing via home through a VPN).
Actually, it appears to go a step further and drop SMTP connection requests
from outside their customer network!
For Peter:
I think this should work - configure the Outgoing Server in K-9 for your
*Eclipse* account to be:
server: smtp.googlemail.com
security: SSL/TLS
port: 465
require sign-in: tick
username: yourgoogleusername@googlemail.com
authentication: normal password
password: yourgooglepassword (or an application-specific password
<https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en> if
you're using Google 2-Step Verification
<https://www.google.com/landing/2step/> - which, incidentally, I
*strongly* recommend, albeit at the cost of a bit more complexity)
Assuming, of course, that the telco whose network you're roaming on doesn't
block SMTPS connections!
Best Regards,
Alex
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
>> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
>> Sent: 18 February 2015 10:06
>> To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group
>> Subject: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am still catching up with this new world of Smartphones!
>>
>> I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
>> several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried sending
>> mail!
>>
>> Whilst on holiday I tried to send "wish you were here" messages and it
>> refused to connect to Eclipses smtp server which I had set and thought I had
>> settings incorrect!
>>
>> After a quick call to my ISP I realized I could not send through my ISP but was
>> told I could easily set up K-9 to post via my gmail account and receive from
>> eclipse.
>>
>> Unfortunately I cannot find where the smtp settings are for "Mail" on the
>> Android but did a bit of googling and found some information however it still
>> will not send via my gmail account. I can send a message from the "Mail" app
>> to my eclipse account but would like to do it from my normal K-9 app on the
>> phone.
>>
>> FYI on my K-9 > settings > Account settings > Sending mail > Outgoing server I
>> have:
>>
>> smtp server - smtp.gmail.com
>> Security - SSL/TLS
>> Port - 587
>> Requiring sign-in is ticked
>>
>> Any help to get this to work would be appreciated.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> --
>> Peter H
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Bristol mailing list
>> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:25:20 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B214@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
> I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
> several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried sending
> mail!
[snip]
Damn - just realised I've committed multiple mailing list felonies - top-posting (which I blame on having to use LookOut which pretty much forces you to top-post) and not actually reading the mail, resulting in answering the wrong question. Apologies. :(
Anyway, I've been considering setting up a RPi as a VPN server so that I can get my phone to appear to be on my home network.
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 1
***************************************
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
bristol-request@mailman.lug.org.uk
You can reach the person managing the list at
bristol-owner@mailman.lug.org.uk
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Peter Hemmings)
2. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
3. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (david)
4. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (Alex Butcher)
5. Re: Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9) (David Smith)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:06:22 +0000
From: Peter Hemmings <peter@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E4641E.7080207@hemmings.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Hi,
I am still catching up with this new world of Smartphones!
I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried
sending mail!
Whilst on holiday I tried to send "wish you were here" messages and it
refused to connect to Eclipses smtp server which I had set and thought I
had settings incorrect!
After a quick call to my ISP I realized I could not send through my ISP
but was told I could easily set up K-9 to post via my gmail account and
receive from eclipse.
Unfortunately I cannot find where the smtp settings are for "Mail" on
the Android but did a bit of googling and found some information however
it still will not send via my gmail account. I can send a message from
the "Mail" app to my eclipse account but would like to do it from my
normal K-9 app on the phone.
FYI on my K-9 > settings > Account settings > Sending mail > Outgoing
server I have:
smtp server - smtp.gmail.com
Security - SSL/TLS
Port - 587
Requiring sign-in is ticked
Any help to get this to work would be appreciated.
Regards
--
Peter H
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:09:14 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B1E7@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I'm using the same (K9 with Eclipse); I'll have a look at my phone settings.
One thing to remember - Eclipse's outgoing SMTP server rejects mails if you're not contacting it via your Eclipse broadband connection. Therefore, you can only send outgoing mails when you're actually at home (or maybe routing via home through a VPN).
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
> Sent: 18 February 2015 10:06
> To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group
> Subject: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
>
> Hi,
>
> I am still catching up with this new world of Smartphones!
>
> I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
> several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried sending
> mail!
>
> Whilst on holiday I tried to send "wish you were here" messages and it
> refused to connect to Eclipses smtp server which I had set and thought I had
> settings incorrect!
>
> After a quick call to my ISP I realized I could not send through my ISP but was
> told I could easily set up K-9 to post via my gmail account and receive from
> eclipse.
>
> Unfortunately I cannot find where the smtp settings are for "Mail" on the
> Android but did a bit of googling and found some information however it still
> will not send via my gmail account. I can send a message from the "Mail" app
> to my eclipse account but would like to do it from my normal K-9 app on the
> phone.
>
> FYI on my K-9 > settings > Account settings > Sending mail > Outgoing server I
> have:
>
> smtp server - smtp.gmail.com
> Security - SSL/TLS
> Port - 587
> Requiring sign-in is ticked
>
> Any help to get this to work would be appreciated.
>
> Regards
>
> --
> Peter H
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:14:32 +0000
From: david <david@avoncliff.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID: <54E46608.9020809@avoncliff.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
On 18/02/15 10:09, David Smith wrote:
> I'm using the same (K9 with Eclipse); I'll have a look at my phone settings.
>
> One thing to remember - Eclipse's outgoing SMTP server rejects mails if you're not contacting it via your Eclipse broadband connection. Therefore, you can only send outgoing mails when you're actually at home (or maybe routing via home through a VPN).
>
A problem I have had when away from home is hotels and other wi-fi
filtering email ports. Nothing standard, some times it works, sometimes
you can get round it, worst case resort to web mail.
David
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
>> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
>> Sent: 18 February 2015 10:06
>> To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group
>> Subject: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am still catching up with this new world of Smartphones!
>>
>> I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
>> several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried sending
>> mail!
>>
>> Whilst on holiday I tried to send "wish you were here" messages and it
>> refused to connect to Eclipses smtp server which I had set and thought I had
>> settings incorrect!
>>
>> After a quick call to my ISP I realized I could not send through my ISP but was
>> told I could easily set up K-9 to post via my gmail account and receive from
>> eclipse.
>>
>> Unfortunately I cannot find where the smtp settings are for "Mail" on the
>> Android but did a bit of googling and found some information however it still
>> will not send via my gmail account. I can send a message from the "Mail" app
>> to my eclipse account but would like to do it from my normal K-9 app on the
>> phone.
>>
>> FYI on my K-9 > settings > Account settings > Sending mail > Outgoing server I
>> have:
>>
>> smtp server - smtp.gmail.com
>> Security - SSL/TLS
>> Port - 587
>> Requiring sign-in is ticked
>>
>> Any help to get this to work would be appreciated.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> --
>> Peter H
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Bristol mailing list
>> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:20:26 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502181014400.4292@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015, David Smith wrote:
> I'm using the same (K9 with Eclipse); I'll have a look at my phone settings.
>
> One thing to remember - Eclipse's outgoing SMTP server rejects mails if you're not contacting it via your Eclipse broadband connection. Therefore, you can only send outgoing mails when you're actually at home (or maybe routing via home through a VPN).
Actually, it appears to go a step further and drop SMTP connection requests
from outside their customer network!
For Peter:
I think this should work - configure the Outgoing Server in K-9 for your
*Eclipse* account to be:
server: smtp.googlemail.com
security: SSL/TLS
port: 465
require sign-in: tick
username: yourgoogleusername@googlemail.com
authentication: normal password
password: yourgooglepassword (or an application-specific password
<https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833?hl=en> if
you're using Google 2-Step Verification
<https://www.google.com/landing/2step/> - which, incidentally, I
*strongly* recommend, albeit at the cost of a bit more complexity)
Assuming, of course, that the telco whose network you're roaming on doesn't
block SMTPS connections!
Best Regards,
Alex
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
>> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
>> Sent: 18 February 2015 10:06
>> To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group
>> Subject: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am still catching up with this new world of Smartphones!
>>
>> I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
>> several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried sending
>> mail!
>>
>> Whilst on holiday I tried to send "wish you were here" messages and it
>> refused to connect to Eclipses smtp server which I had set and thought I had
>> settings incorrect!
>>
>> After a quick call to my ISP I realized I could not send through my ISP but was
>> told I could easily set up K-9 to post via my gmail account and receive from
>> eclipse.
>>
>> Unfortunately I cannot find where the smtp settings are for "Mail" on the
>> Android but did a bit of googling and found some information however it still
>> will not send via my gmail account. I can send a message from the "Mail" app
>> to my eclipse account but would like to do it from my normal K-9 app on the
>> phone.
>>
>> FYI on my K-9 > settings > Account settings > Sending mail > Outgoing server I
>> have:
>>
>> smtp server - smtp.gmail.com
>> Security - SSL/TLS
>> Port - 587
>> Requiring sign-in is ticked
>>
>> Any help to get this to work would be appreciated.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> --
>> Peter H
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Bristol mailing list
>> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:25:20 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Problem with mail on Smartphone (K-9)
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888B214@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Peter Hemmings
> I had set up my smartphone to download messages from my Eclipse ISP
> several months ago via IMAP and all works OK but I had never tried sending
> mail!
[snip]
Damn - just realised I've committed multiple mailing list felonies - top-posting (which I blame on having to use LookOut which pretty much forces you to top-post) and not actually reading the mail, resulting in answering the wrong question. Apologies. :(
Anyway, I've been considering setting up a RPi as a VPN server so that I can get my phone to appear to be on my home network.
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 590, Issue 1
***************************************
Kamis, 12 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 3
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Old manuals and the like (Steve Netting)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:57:06 -0000
From: "Steve Netting" <steve@track3.org.uk>
To: "Bristol and Bath Linux User Group" <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID:
<55c0f488797c516882a4a07b41bfbe86.squirrel@webmail.track3.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
Before you bin anything, The Museum of Computing in Swindon would probably
give any remaining items a home. I could probably even collect on their
behalf.
Would you like me to ask the question?
Steve M0SPN
> I have also discovered a collection on CP/M documentation together
> with 8" floppies of bootable system, Wordstar and other stuff.
> Surely no one is interested in that! Really must curb my hoarding
> instinct
> ==John ffitch
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 3
***************************************
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To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Old manuals and the like (Steve Netting)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:57:06 -0000
From: "Steve Netting" <steve@track3.org.uk>
To: "Bristol and Bath Linux User Group" <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID:
<55c0f488797c516882a4a07b41bfbe86.squirrel@webmail.track3.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
Before you bin anything, The Museum of Computing in Swindon would probably
give any remaining items a home. I could probably even collect on their
behalf.
Would you like me to ask the question?
Steve M0SPN
> I have also discovered a collection on CP/M documentation together
> with 8" floppies of bootable system, Wordstar and other stuff.
> Surely no one is interested in that! Really must curb my hoarding
> instinct
> ==John ffitch
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 3
***************************************
Rabu, 11 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 2
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Old manuals and the like (jpff)
2. Re: Old manuals and the like (Nigel Sollars)
3. Re: Old manuals and the like (Allen Coates)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 17:53:01 +0000
From: jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID: <8559-Tue10Feb2015175301+0000-jpff@codemist.co.uk>
I have also discovered a collection on CP/M documentation together
with 8" floppies of bootable system, Wordstar and other stuff.
Surely no one is interested in that! Really must curb my hoarding
instinct
==John ffitch
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 13:32:28 -0500
From: Nigel Sollars <nsollars@gmail.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID:
<CAG6aBkUh4Lmu9_zfPzCB+t-ppxf1V5YgRfQ-qQ2SjbzZ4UmQXA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hehe, thats mighty impressive
Nige
On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 12:53 PM, jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk> wrote:
> I have also discovered a collection on CP/M documentation together
> with 8" floppies of bootable system, Wordstar and other stuff.
> Surely no one is interested in that! Really must curb my hoarding
> instinct
> ==John ffitch
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
--
?Science is a differential equation. Religion is a boundary condition.?
Alan Turing
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------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 23:01:48 +0000
From: Allen Coates <lug-7@cidercounty.org.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID: <54DA8DDC.6070208@cidercounty.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
And I have discovered a copy of SCO Unix (Open Desktop / Open Server),
boxed with manuals. Dating from about 1994
Allen C
On 10/02/15 17:53, jpff wrote:
> I have also discovered a collection on CP/M documentation together
> with 8" floppies of bootable system, Wordstar and other stuff.
> Surely no one is interested in that! Really must curb my hoarding
> instinct
> ==John ffitch
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 2
***************************************
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Old manuals and the like (jpff)
2. Re: Old manuals and the like (Nigel Sollars)
3. Re: Old manuals and the like (Allen Coates)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 17:53:01 +0000
From: jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID: <8559-Tue10Feb2015175301+0000-jpff@codemist.co.uk>
I have also discovered a collection on CP/M documentation together
with 8" floppies of bootable system, Wordstar and other stuff.
Surely no one is interested in that! Really must curb my hoarding
instinct
==John ffitch
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 13:32:28 -0500
From: Nigel Sollars <nsollars@gmail.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID:
<CAG6aBkUh4Lmu9_zfPzCB+t-ppxf1V5YgRfQ-qQ2SjbzZ4UmQXA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hehe, thats mighty impressive
Nige
On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 12:53 PM, jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk> wrote:
> I have also discovered a collection on CP/M documentation together
> with 8" floppies of bootable system, Wordstar and other stuff.
> Surely no one is interested in that! Really must curb my hoarding
> instinct
> ==John ffitch
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
--
?Science is a differential equation. Religion is a boundary condition.?
Alan Turing
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------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 23:01:48 +0000
From: Allen Coates <lug-7@cidercounty.org.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID: <54DA8DDC.6070208@cidercounty.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
And I have discovered a copy of SCO Unix (Open Desktop / Open Server),
boxed with manuals. Dating from about 1994
Allen C
On 10/02/15 17:53, jpff wrote:
> I have also discovered a collection on CP/M documentation together
> with 8" floppies of bootable system, Wordstar and other stuff.
> Surely no one is interested in that! Really must curb my hoarding
> instinct
> ==John ffitch
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 2
***************************************
Senin, 09 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 1
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
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than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Old manuals and the like (jpff)
2. Re: Old manuals and the like (Andy Osborne)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2015 15:12:01 +0000
From: jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID: <5427-Sun08Feb2015151201+0000-jpff@codemist.co.uk>
I retired a few years ago from paid employment; I really need to clear
the space around my workstation so I can station myself to work (on
music). I have collected a rather large archive of computer books and
manuals from the 1950s onwards; I have just arranged for some of the
rarer items to go to a repository library but that still leave a lot.
If anyone wants any of these you are welcome, but they would need to be
collected from Combe Down or possibly University of Bath, and soon as
otherwise I will recycle them. List of items follows in no particular
order. Also got 8" floppy discs for PERQ, system and development sets.
==John ffitch
========================================================================
@Manual{Multics,
title = {Level 68 Software: Multics Programmers' Manual Reference Guide},
organization = {Honeywell},
note = {No date, but post 1973},
}
@Manual{Coral66,
title = {Official Definition of CORAL 66},
organization = {Inter-Establishment Committee on Computer Applications},
month = {June},
year = {1972},
note = {Xerox of a 1970 document},
}
@Manual{Phoenix,
title = {Cambridge Phoenix/MVS User's Guide},
author = {K. Edgecombe},
organization = {University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory},
address = {Corn Exchange Street, Cambridge, CB2 3QG},
month = {April},
year = {1984},
}
@Manual{BCPL370,
title = {BCPL on the Cambridge IBM 370/165},
author = {C. J. Jardine},
organization = {University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory},
address = {Corn Exchange Street, Cambridge, CB2 3QG},
month = {March},
year = {1981},
}
@Manual{FortranBath,
title = {FORTRAN: An Introductory Manual},
organization = {University of Bath School of Mathematics},
year = {1982},
}
@Manual{CAMAL,
title = {CAMAL Users manual},
author = {John Fitch},
organization = {University of Cambridge Computer Laborator},
address = {Corn Exchange Street, Cambridge, CB2 3QG},
edition = {Second},
month = {May},
year = {1882},
}
@Book{PDP11,
ALTauthor = {},
ALTeditor = {},
title = {PDP11 Peripherals and Interfacing Handbook},
publisher = {Digital Equipment Corporation},
year = {1971},
note = {2 copies},
}
@Misc{PDP15,
title = {PDP15 Instruction List},
howpublished = {Digital Equipment Corporation Leaflet},
year = {n.d.},
}
@Misc{PDP8I,
title = {PDP-8/I Instruction List},
howpublished = {Leaflet by Digital Equipment Corporation Leaflet},
note = {F-816 5/68},
}
@Misc{HPBasic,
title = {Quick Guide for HP Access Basic},
howpublished = {Leaflet by BP Computer Centre},
}
@Misc{Intel8080,
title = {Intel 8085/8080 Assembly Language Reference Card},
month = {April},
year = {1977},
note = {169-0477-20K-CG-BL},
}
@Booklet{PDP1520,
title = {PDP-15/20 User's Guide},
howpublished = {Digital Equipment Corporation Leaflet},
year = {1971},
}
@Manual{LeedsDec10,
title = {DEC system 10 Users Manual},
author = {Peter Jesty},
organization = {Department of Computer Studies},
address = {University of Leeds},
edition = {Sixth},
month = {September},
year = {1978},
}
@Manual{Focal,
title = {Focal},
year = {n.d.},
note = {A new conversational language for PDP-8},
annote = {Two copies}
}
University of Cambridge Mathematical Laboratory:
-----------------------------------------------
Titan Mixed Language System - MLS; The IAL Library
RARDE Technical Report 10/77. The Mathematical Symbolic Manipulation
Language MIRA, Part 4 User's Manual, H J Gawlik,
(Sep 1977) Fort Halstead [Copy 37]
Cambridge 370/165 Users' Reference Manual Pt I, P. Stewart and R J
Stubbs (March 1978) 3rd Edition with Amendments 3
Cambridge 370/165 Users' Reference Manual Pt II, P. Stewart and R J
Stubbs (October 1978) 4rd Edition
U of Cambridge: IBM 370/165 WATFIV User's Guide 2nd edition (March
1972), reprinted Oct 1973 with amendments 1 and 2
(16 Oct 1973)
-----
GEC 4000 series computers (GEC 4070, 4080, 4082) Technical description
(5 Nov 1976) 112 pages
OPUS, The GEC Computers Multi-access system(1976)
Honeywell Level 68/DPS Summary Description (1978). 50 pages
Honeywell Level 60 Level 66 Summary Description (1975). 85 pages
Honeywell Level 6 Minicomputers (1976) 14 pages
Honeywell Level 6 Minicomputer System (nd) 16 pages
Intersystems Pascal/2, Ithaca Intersystems, Jeff Moskow (1980)[or Z80]
CP/M Dynamic Debugging Tool (DDT) User's Guide (1976, 1978), Digital
Research
Making it Work -- Perihelion Software Ltd (nd, late 1980 I think)
A Catalogue of Artificial Intelligence Tools: Spring 1983, SERC, ed S
Bundy, J Lumley, M Merry, K Sparck-Jones
B700 Systems: System Software Operational Guide, Burroughs
Corp. (April 1975)
B700 Systems: COBOL Reference Manual (1974)
Series 60 (Level 68) Multics Programmers' Manual -- Commands and Active
Functiopns Addendum B (Feb 1979) over 500 pages
Level 68 Software Index to Multics Manuals (Mar 1979)
RARDE Technical Report 1/75. The Mathematical Symbolic Manipulation
Language MIRA, Part 1 Design Objectives, Data
Structure, and Basic Commands, H J Gawlik,
(Jan 1975) Fort Halstead [Copy 70]
RARDE Technical Report 122/75. The Mathematical Symbolic Manipulation
Language MIRA, Part 2. Indefinite Integration,
Fourier Conversion and iInteractive Working, H J
Gawlik, (Dec 1975) Fort Halstead [Copy 97] [includes
paper output and comp slip from Jim Gawlik]
RARDE Technical Report 10/77. The Mathematical Symbolic Manipulation
Language MIRA, Part 4 User's Manual, H J Gawlik,
(Sep 1977) Fort Halstead [Copy 37]
Digital Processor Handbook PDP11/40 (1972)
Digital peripherals and Interfacing Handbook PDP11/40 (1971)
ALAM Programmer's Manual, R.A.d'Inverno (Dept of Mathematics, Kings
College London) nd (but probably 1969 or 1970)
[Atlas Lisp Algebraic Manipulator]
Digital PDP10 Reference GHandbook (1969)
Digital PDP10 Timesharing Handbook (1970)
Digital VAX11 780 Technical Summary (1977)
Decsystem-10 SIMULA Language Handbook Part1 (Oct 1978) 326 pages
IBM System/360 Principles of Operation, 9th edition (1970)
IBM System/360 Operating System: Programmer's Guide to Debugging (OS
Release 21.7), 8th Edition (Aug 1974)
IBM System/360 Operating System: Messages and Codes(OS Release 21.7),
13th edition (April 1973)
IBM System/360 Operating System: Messages and Codes ammendments 15 Feb
1978
LISP 1.6, Lynn H Quam (Sept 1969), DECUS Program Library 6/10-38A
Acorn 6502 ADE, Acorn Technical Manual Issue 1 (Sep 1980) 21 pages
Plessey Miproc 16 Systems Databook; 16 bit microcomputer systems (Feb
1977) Issue 2, 102 pages
BCPL MATERIAL
-------------
BCPL User Group Newletter Number 1 -- August 1982
BCPL User Group Newletter Number 2 -- February 1983
BCPL Mini-Manual (Jan 1974) University of Essex Computing Centre
BCPL User Group Members List
BCPL User Group Meeting Delegates
The BCPL User Group -- announcement of second meeting to be held
23June 1980
BCPL Reference Manual (Essex Version) (nd but after 1973 and prob
before 1980
BCPL (1900) System Manual, A. J. Powell (nd)
----------
The BCPL Programming Manual, M Richards, (April 1973) The Computer
Laboratory
The BCPL Mini-Manual, I Willers and S Mellor (April 1976) CERN
Agenda of BCPL User Group Meeting 23June 1980 [with hand-written notes
by JPff]
Computer Laboratory Cambridge, Notes to accompany the course entitled
'Programming Languages and Compiling Techniques"
(1972) M. Richards
IBM System/370 Reference Summary 5th edition 1981 (GX20-1850-4)
University Mathematics Laboratory, Cambridge: Sciope Text Editor III
(PDP-7 Library Specification, R E Thomas and N E
Wiseman (16 May 1966) [A later xerox copy from about
1970]
bound with
Load and Go Assembler, C.W.S [Colin
Whitby-Strevens](20 Jul 1966)
CLAM (CDC LISP Algebraic Manipulation) Part 1, R A D'Inverno and R A
Russell-Clark, (nd) [For the CDC Computer at U of
London in ~1969]
CLAM (CDC LISP Algebraic Manipulation) Part 2, R A D'Inverno and R A
Russell-Clark, (nd)
The LISP Museum [A catalog of papers on LISP from 1955 to
1985],. Herbert Stoyan [originally from DDR he was
in Erlangen when this version was written]
Introduction to the LISP System Opertions Manual, Lisa A Raphals and
Sarah Smith (LMI) (1983)
Cambridge LISP 68000 Language, Metacomco (Tenchstar
Ltd)(1983). [includes how to use on Tripos and the
Fitch/Norman manual for Cambridge LISP]
GINO-F User Manual Issue 2 (1976) with additions from U of Exeter(25
May 1976); GINO-F Updates (Jan 1976); Multics GINO-F
Notes (1980) [all in ring-back South West
Information Manual]
University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory Algebraic Manipulation, In
three parts (19 Feb 1971, March 1971, March 1971)
S R Bourne [lecture notes from a short seminar
series]
Introduction to PERQ microprogramming, AMJ Hutchins (11 Jun 1982) ICL,
20 pages
Microprogrammer's Guide to the PERQ Fixed Disc, C I Morrison (11 Mar
1982) ICKL, 15 pages
PERQ QCode Reference Manual, Miles A Barel and John P Strait, Three
Rivers Computer Corporation (3 Sep 1980) 48 pages
South West Information Manual; LISP -- Running LISP Under MULTIJOB, D
Cannon (6 Jul 1979) 5 pages
Lisp Paper No. 1, D B Russell (26 Apr 1966) Science Research Council
Atlas Computer Laboratory, 5 pages
Coloured Brochure for Darkstar from Sirius Microtech Ltd [UK designed
M68000 machine, running TRIPOS] (nd) but about 1983
or 1984
Sirius Microtech Ltd, Darkstar Specification (nd; evidence of 1982) 5
pages
BAAS Annual Meeting 4-8 Sept 1978 "The Large Parallel Computer and
University Research", R W Hockney
Cromemco Disk Operating System (CDOS) User's Manual (Nov 1978) [Bound,
over 100 pages]
University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory Technical Report No. 1,
The Jackdaw Database Package, M F Challis (Oct 1974)
DEC Focal - a new conversational lanuage for PDP-8. (nd) two copies
DECsystem 10 Users Manual , University of Leeds Dept of Computer
Studies (Sixth edition) (Sept 1978), P Jesty, 58
pages
OPDP-15/20 User's Guide -- ADVANCED Monitor Software Systems (1971)
perating
Intel 8085/8080 Assembly Language Rnual eference Card (April 1977)
BP (??) Computer Centre Quick Guide for HP Access Basic (nd)
Digital PDP-8/I Instruction List (nd; 1968?)
PDP-15 Instruction List (nd; 1968?)
Cambridge LISP for the Atari ST (1986) Complete with manual and floppy
disks in original package]
BCPL for the Atari ST (1986) Complete with manual and floppy
disks in original package]
University of Cambridge Mathematical Laboratory: Technical Memorandun
65/2: A Language for facilitating the use of Forman
Derivatives in Numerical Analysis; M V Wilkes (March 1965)
University of Bath School of Mathematics. Perq BCPL Documentation,
Julian Padget and John Fitch (Feb 1983)
The BCPL Mini-Manual, S Mellor and Ian Willers (Feb 1978), CERN Data
Handling Division
BCPL Cintcode User Guide, Richards Copmputer Products Ltd (1980;
revised Aug 1982)
PERQ
----
PERQ Microprogramming Model (single page from manual)
PERQ Micro-Progammer's Guide (3 May 1981) 4 pages + example program of
drawing a circle
Cambridge Capability Machine
----------------------------
University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory, CAP macro-orders (10 Apr
1975); on line-printer paper
CHAOS User Reference Manual (CAP Operating System) C J Slinn (16 pages)
CAP Hardware Manual, C J Slinn (ed) version 1.3, (5 Jul 1976), 82
pages
South West Information Manual; Multics Commands -- The
enter_network_job Command (222 Sep 1980) R G
Bradshaw
A New Remote -Accessed Man-Machine System -- Reprints of papers on
MULTICS at FJCC, Las Vegas 30 Nov 1965, distributed
by General Electric Company
Unidentified Manual for IBM system at Rutherford 2nd edition (Feb
1972)
High Level Hardware Orion Microarchitecture reference Manual, (1983)
161 pages
Tripos Manual for Sage Computer, Metacomco Ltd
**end**
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2015 17:15:17 +0000
From: Andy Osborne <andy@oznet.demon.co.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID: <54D799A5.8000607@oznet.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
John,
Can I suggest asking this question on the Unix Heritage Society list;
see http://www.tuhs.org/ and http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs
I suspect there are people on there who would be very interested in
some of this.
Cheers,
Andy
On 08/02/15 15:12, jpff wrote:
> I retired a few years ago from paid employment; I really need to clear
> the space around my workstation so I can station myself to work (on
> music). I have collected a rather large archive of computer books and
> manuals from the 1950s onwards; I have just arranged for some of the
> rarer items to go to a repository library but that still leave a lot.
> If anyone wants any of these you are welcome, but they would need to be
> collected from Combe Down or possibly University of Bath, and soon as
> otherwise I will recycle them. List of items follows in no particular
> order. Also got 8" floppy discs for PERQ, system and development sets.
>
> ==John ffitch
> ========================================================================
[snip]
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 1
***************************************
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To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Old manuals and the like (jpff)
2. Re: Old manuals and the like (Andy Osborne)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2015 15:12:01 +0000
From: jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID: <5427-Sun08Feb2015151201+0000-jpff@codemist.co.uk>
I retired a few years ago from paid employment; I really need to clear
the space around my workstation so I can station myself to work (on
music). I have collected a rather large archive of computer books and
manuals from the 1950s onwards; I have just arranged for some of the
rarer items to go to a repository library but that still leave a lot.
If anyone wants any of these you are welcome, but they would need to be
collected from Combe Down or possibly University of Bath, and soon as
otherwise I will recycle them. List of items follows in no particular
order. Also got 8" floppy discs for PERQ, system and development sets.
==John ffitch
========================================================================
@Manual{Multics,
title = {Level 68 Software: Multics Programmers' Manual Reference Guide},
organization = {Honeywell},
note = {No date, but post 1973},
}
@Manual{Coral66,
title = {Official Definition of CORAL 66},
organization = {Inter-Establishment Committee on Computer Applications},
month = {June},
year = {1972},
note = {Xerox of a 1970 document},
}
@Manual{Phoenix,
title = {Cambridge Phoenix/MVS User's Guide},
author = {K. Edgecombe},
organization = {University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory},
address = {Corn Exchange Street, Cambridge, CB2 3QG},
month = {April},
year = {1984},
}
@Manual{BCPL370,
title = {BCPL on the Cambridge IBM 370/165},
author = {C. J. Jardine},
organization = {University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory},
address = {Corn Exchange Street, Cambridge, CB2 3QG},
month = {March},
year = {1981},
}
@Manual{FortranBath,
title = {FORTRAN: An Introductory Manual},
organization = {University of Bath School of Mathematics},
year = {1982},
}
@Manual{CAMAL,
title = {CAMAL Users manual},
author = {John Fitch},
organization = {University of Cambridge Computer Laborator},
address = {Corn Exchange Street, Cambridge, CB2 3QG},
edition = {Second},
month = {May},
year = {1882},
}
@Book{PDP11,
ALTauthor = {},
ALTeditor = {},
title = {PDP11 Peripherals and Interfacing Handbook},
publisher = {Digital Equipment Corporation},
year = {1971},
note = {2 copies},
}
@Misc{PDP15,
title = {PDP15 Instruction List},
howpublished = {Digital Equipment Corporation Leaflet},
year = {n.d.},
}
@Misc{PDP8I,
title = {PDP-8/I Instruction List},
howpublished = {Leaflet by Digital Equipment Corporation Leaflet},
note = {F-816 5/68},
}
@Misc{HPBasic,
title = {Quick Guide for HP Access Basic},
howpublished = {Leaflet by BP Computer Centre},
}
@Misc{Intel8080,
title = {Intel 8085/8080 Assembly Language Reference Card},
month = {April},
year = {1977},
note = {169-0477-20K-CG-BL},
}
@Booklet{PDP1520,
title = {PDP-15/20 User's Guide},
howpublished = {Digital Equipment Corporation Leaflet},
year = {1971},
}
@Manual{LeedsDec10,
title = {DEC system 10 Users Manual},
author = {Peter Jesty},
organization = {Department of Computer Studies},
address = {University of Leeds},
edition = {Sixth},
month = {September},
year = {1978},
}
@Manual{Focal,
title = {Focal},
year = {n.d.},
note = {A new conversational language for PDP-8},
annote = {Two copies}
}
University of Cambridge Mathematical Laboratory:
-----------------------------------------------
Titan Mixed Language System - MLS; The IAL Library
RARDE Technical Report 10/77. The Mathematical Symbolic Manipulation
Language MIRA, Part 4 User's Manual, H J Gawlik,
(Sep 1977) Fort Halstead [Copy 37]
Cambridge 370/165 Users' Reference Manual Pt I, P. Stewart and R J
Stubbs (March 1978) 3rd Edition with Amendments 3
Cambridge 370/165 Users' Reference Manual Pt II, P. Stewart and R J
Stubbs (October 1978) 4rd Edition
U of Cambridge: IBM 370/165 WATFIV User's Guide 2nd edition (March
1972), reprinted Oct 1973 with amendments 1 and 2
(16 Oct 1973)
-----
GEC 4000 series computers (GEC 4070, 4080, 4082) Technical description
(5 Nov 1976) 112 pages
OPUS, The GEC Computers Multi-access system(1976)
Honeywell Level 68/DPS Summary Description (1978). 50 pages
Honeywell Level 60 Level 66 Summary Description (1975). 85 pages
Honeywell Level 6 Minicomputers (1976) 14 pages
Honeywell Level 6 Minicomputer System (nd) 16 pages
Intersystems Pascal/2, Ithaca Intersystems, Jeff Moskow (1980)[or Z80]
CP/M Dynamic Debugging Tool (DDT) User's Guide (1976, 1978), Digital
Research
Making it Work -- Perihelion Software Ltd (nd, late 1980 I think)
A Catalogue of Artificial Intelligence Tools: Spring 1983, SERC, ed S
Bundy, J Lumley, M Merry, K Sparck-Jones
B700 Systems: System Software Operational Guide, Burroughs
Corp. (April 1975)
B700 Systems: COBOL Reference Manual (1974)
Series 60 (Level 68) Multics Programmers' Manual -- Commands and Active
Functiopns Addendum B (Feb 1979) over 500 pages
Level 68 Software Index to Multics Manuals (Mar 1979)
RARDE Technical Report 1/75. The Mathematical Symbolic Manipulation
Language MIRA, Part 1 Design Objectives, Data
Structure, and Basic Commands, H J Gawlik,
(Jan 1975) Fort Halstead [Copy 70]
RARDE Technical Report 122/75. The Mathematical Symbolic Manipulation
Language MIRA, Part 2. Indefinite Integration,
Fourier Conversion and iInteractive Working, H J
Gawlik, (Dec 1975) Fort Halstead [Copy 97] [includes
paper output and comp slip from Jim Gawlik]
RARDE Technical Report 10/77. The Mathematical Symbolic Manipulation
Language MIRA, Part 4 User's Manual, H J Gawlik,
(Sep 1977) Fort Halstead [Copy 37]
Digital Processor Handbook PDP11/40 (1972)
Digital peripherals and Interfacing Handbook PDP11/40 (1971)
ALAM Programmer's Manual, R.A.d'Inverno (Dept of Mathematics, Kings
College London) nd (but probably 1969 or 1970)
[Atlas Lisp Algebraic Manipulator]
Digital PDP10 Reference GHandbook (1969)
Digital PDP10 Timesharing Handbook (1970)
Digital VAX11 780 Technical Summary (1977)
Decsystem-10 SIMULA Language Handbook Part1 (Oct 1978) 326 pages
IBM System/360 Principles of Operation, 9th edition (1970)
IBM System/360 Operating System: Programmer's Guide to Debugging (OS
Release 21.7), 8th Edition (Aug 1974)
IBM System/360 Operating System: Messages and Codes(OS Release 21.7),
13th edition (April 1973)
IBM System/360 Operating System: Messages and Codes ammendments 15 Feb
1978
LISP 1.6, Lynn H Quam (Sept 1969), DECUS Program Library 6/10-38A
Acorn 6502 ADE, Acorn Technical Manual Issue 1 (Sep 1980) 21 pages
Plessey Miproc 16 Systems Databook; 16 bit microcomputer systems (Feb
1977) Issue 2, 102 pages
BCPL MATERIAL
-------------
BCPL User Group Newletter Number 1 -- August 1982
BCPL User Group Newletter Number 2 -- February 1983
BCPL Mini-Manual (Jan 1974) University of Essex Computing Centre
BCPL User Group Members List
BCPL User Group Meeting Delegates
The BCPL User Group -- announcement of second meeting to be held
23June 1980
BCPL Reference Manual (Essex Version) (nd but after 1973 and prob
before 1980
BCPL (1900) System Manual, A. J. Powell (nd)
----------
The BCPL Programming Manual, M Richards, (April 1973) The Computer
Laboratory
The BCPL Mini-Manual, I Willers and S Mellor (April 1976) CERN
Agenda of BCPL User Group Meeting 23June 1980 [with hand-written notes
by JPff]
Computer Laboratory Cambridge, Notes to accompany the course entitled
'Programming Languages and Compiling Techniques"
(1972) M. Richards
IBM System/370 Reference Summary 5th edition 1981 (GX20-1850-4)
University Mathematics Laboratory, Cambridge: Sciope Text Editor III
(PDP-7 Library Specification, R E Thomas and N E
Wiseman (16 May 1966) [A later xerox copy from about
1970]
bound with
Load and Go Assembler, C.W.S [Colin
Whitby-Strevens](20 Jul 1966)
CLAM (CDC LISP Algebraic Manipulation) Part 1, R A D'Inverno and R A
Russell-Clark, (nd) [For the CDC Computer at U of
London in ~1969]
CLAM (CDC LISP Algebraic Manipulation) Part 2, R A D'Inverno and R A
Russell-Clark, (nd)
The LISP Museum [A catalog of papers on LISP from 1955 to
1985],. Herbert Stoyan [originally from DDR he was
in Erlangen when this version was written]
Introduction to the LISP System Opertions Manual, Lisa A Raphals and
Sarah Smith (LMI) (1983)
Cambridge LISP 68000 Language, Metacomco (Tenchstar
Ltd)(1983). [includes how to use on Tripos and the
Fitch/Norman manual for Cambridge LISP]
GINO-F User Manual Issue 2 (1976) with additions from U of Exeter(25
May 1976); GINO-F Updates (Jan 1976); Multics GINO-F
Notes (1980) [all in ring-back South West
Information Manual]
University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory Algebraic Manipulation, In
three parts (19 Feb 1971, March 1971, March 1971)
S R Bourne [lecture notes from a short seminar
series]
Introduction to PERQ microprogramming, AMJ Hutchins (11 Jun 1982) ICL,
20 pages
Microprogrammer's Guide to the PERQ Fixed Disc, C I Morrison (11 Mar
1982) ICKL, 15 pages
PERQ QCode Reference Manual, Miles A Barel and John P Strait, Three
Rivers Computer Corporation (3 Sep 1980) 48 pages
South West Information Manual; LISP -- Running LISP Under MULTIJOB, D
Cannon (6 Jul 1979) 5 pages
Lisp Paper No. 1, D B Russell (26 Apr 1966) Science Research Council
Atlas Computer Laboratory, 5 pages
Coloured Brochure for Darkstar from Sirius Microtech Ltd [UK designed
M68000 machine, running TRIPOS] (nd) but about 1983
or 1984
Sirius Microtech Ltd, Darkstar Specification (nd; evidence of 1982) 5
pages
BAAS Annual Meeting 4-8 Sept 1978 "The Large Parallel Computer and
University Research", R W Hockney
Cromemco Disk Operating System (CDOS) User's Manual (Nov 1978) [Bound,
over 100 pages]
University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory Technical Report No. 1,
The Jackdaw Database Package, M F Challis (Oct 1974)
DEC Focal - a new conversational lanuage for PDP-8. (nd) two copies
DECsystem 10 Users Manual , University of Leeds Dept of Computer
Studies (Sixth edition) (Sept 1978), P Jesty, 58
pages
OPDP-15/20 User's Guide -- ADVANCED Monitor Software Systems (1971)
perating
Intel 8085/8080 Assembly Language Rnual eference Card (April 1977)
BP (??) Computer Centre Quick Guide for HP Access Basic (nd)
Digital PDP-8/I Instruction List (nd; 1968?)
PDP-15 Instruction List (nd; 1968?)
Cambridge LISP for the Atari ST (1986) Complete with manual and floppy
disks in original package]
BCPL for the Atari ST (1986) Complete with manual and floppy
disks in original package]
University of Cambridge Mathematical Laboratory: Technical Memorandun
65/2: A Language for facilitating the use of Forman
Derivatives in Numerical Analysis; M V Wilkes (March 1965)
University of Bath School of Mathematics. Perq BCPL Documentation,
Julian Padget and John Fitch (Feb 1983)
The BCPL Mini-Manual, S Mellor and Ian Willers (Feb 1978), CERN Data
Handling Division
BCPL Cintcode User Guide, Richards Copmputer Products Ltd (1980;
revised Aug 1982)
PERQ
----
PERQ Microprogramming Model (single page from manual)
PERQ Micro-Progammer's Guide (3 May 1981) 4 pages + example program of
drawing a circle
Cambridge Capability Machine
----------------------------
University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory, CAP macro-orders (10 Apr
1975); on line-printer paper
CHAOS User Reference Manual (CAP Operating System) C J Slinn (16 pages)
CAP Hardware Manual, C J Slinn (ed) version 1.3, (5 Jul 1976), 82
pages
South West Information Manual; Multics Commands -- The
enter_network_job Command (222 Sep 1980) R G
Bradshaw
A New Remote -Accessed Man-Machine System -- Reprints of papers on
MULTICS at FJCC, Las Vegas 30 Nov 1965, distributed
by General Electric Company
Unidentified Manual for IBM system at Rutherford 2nd edition (Feb
1972)
High Level Hardware Orion Microarchitecture reference Manual, (1983)
161 pages
Tripos Manual for Sage Computer, Metacomco Ltd
**end**
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2015 17:15:17 +0000
From: Andy Osborne <andy@oznet.demon.co.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Old manuals and the like
Message-ID: <54D799A5.8000607@oznet.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
John,
Can I suggest asking this question on the Unix Heritage Society list;
see http://www.tuhs.org/ and http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs
I suspect there are people on there who would be very interested in
some of this.
Cheers,
Andy
On 08/02/15 15:12, jpff wrote:
> I retired a few years ago from paid employment; I really need to clear
> the space around my workstation so I can station myself to work (on
> music). I have collected a rather large archive of computer books and
> manuals from the 1950s onwards; I have just arranged for some of the
> rarer items to go to a repository library but that still leave a lot.
> If anyone wants any of these you are welcome, but they would need to be
> collected from Combe Down or possibly University of Bath, and soon as
> otherwise I will recycle them. List of items follows in no particular
> order. Also got 8" floppy discs for PERQ, system and development sets.
>
> ==John ffitch
> ========================================================================
[snip]
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 589, Issue 1
***************************************
Jumat, 06 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 6
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
bristol-request@mailman.lug.org.uk
You can reach the person managing the list at
bristol-owner@mailman.lug.org.uk
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Backup email servers (Karl Southern)
2. Re: Backup email servers (Allen Coates)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 14:36:58 +0000
From: Karl Southern <karl@theangryangel.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID: <54D3800A.9070704@theangryangel.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Sorry, a bit late on this one.
Digitalocean do a ?3.27/month VM package. I'm reasonably happy with them
for non-critical purposes, and should be more than enough for the job.
AWS also do a free tier for 12 months, although if you pick EC2 make
sure you understand the limitations and restrictions of working within AWS.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 20:02:23 +0000
From: Allen Coates <lug-7@cidercounty.org.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID: <54D3CC4F.4090500@cidercounty.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Many thanks one and all for your feedback - it has given me food for
thought.
In truth, very little comes through my secondary server - less than one
email a week (at the moment). But it's nice to have something ready in
case they do start to inundating the server.
Fortuitously, they seem to have lost interest in the "live" address they
know about, and have turned their attention to one which has been
discontinued (and blocked).
I wonder if "they" have blacklists about "us".
Regards
Allen C
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 6
***************************************
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
bristol-owner@mailman.lug.org.uk
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Backup email servers (Karl Southern)
2. Re: Backup email servers (Allen Coates)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 14:36:58 +0000
From: Karl Southern <karl@theangryangel.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID: <54D3800A.9070704@theangryangel.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Sorry, a bit late on this one.
Digitalocean do a ?3.27/month VM package. I'm reasonably happy with them
for non-critical purposes, and should be more than enough for the job.
AWS also do a free tier for 12 months, although if you pick EC2 make
sure you understand the limitations and restrictions of working within AWS.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 20:02:23 +0000
From: Allen Coates <lug-7@cidercounty.org.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID: <54D3CC4F.4090500@cidercounty.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Many thanks one and all for your feedback - it has given me food for
thought.
In truth, very little comes through my secondary server - less than one
email a week (at the moment). But it's nice to have something ready in
case they do start to inundating the server.
Fortuitously, they seem to have lost interest in the "live" address they
know about, and have turned their attention to one which has been
discontinued (and blocked).
I wonder if "they" have blacklists about "us".
Regards
Allen C
------------------------------
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End of Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 6
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Rabu, 04 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 5
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Backup email servers (Steve King)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2015 09:39:42 -0000
From: "Steve King" <debian@invux.com>
To: "Bristol and Bath Linux User Group" <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID:
<1b0665c27c1da666bc5205b292bc7b1a.squirrel@dazzle.invux.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
I use a Virtual Private Server, it is a Xen paravirtualised services and
has 768Mbytes of memory and 10G of disk and a single core, which I presume
is shared. It costs about ?27 per year. It uses a similar postfix
configuration as my main mail server, so it filters spam, viruses etc. It
is also possible to give it a list of valid email address, although I
haven't had the need to do that.
It was found through http://lowendbox.com/ which does have good deals
occasionally, if you get one before they sell out, I am not affiliated
with them in any way, except as one time customer.
openvz is not a great solution for SMTP, as things like fail2ban don't
work due to the shared nature of the kernel. Xen/KVM costs more, but is
more flexible for the kinds of stuff you want to do with SMTP.
--
Steve
> Hi All
>
> For about five months I have been running a small email server, which
> handles about a dozen messages a day. My "back-up server" is the
> simple email forwarding that came with the DNS account. Currently it is
> pointing at my ISP.
>
> However, some persistent spammer has discovered that my backup does not
> actually refuse *any* messages at all . . .
>
> So I am looking for an alternative that does an honest-to-goodness SMTP
> "bounce" on non-existent email addresses - and preferably will also
> handle DNS blacklists.
>
> I have a dynamic IP address - although it hasn't changed in over a year
> - so I feel I should have a backup of some sort.
>
> Can somebody recommend an (inexpensive) mail back-up service? Or any
> other ideas, short of building a second server and parking it in a
> friend's house?
>
> Allen C
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
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1. Re: Backup email servers (Steve King)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2015 09:39:42 -0000
From: "Steve King" <debian@invux.com>
To: "Bristol and Bath Linux User Group" <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID:
<1b0665c27c1da666bc5205b292bc7b1a.squirrel@dazzle.invux.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
I use a Virtual Private Server, it is a Xen paravirtualised services and
has 768Mbytes of memory and 10G of disk and a single core, which I presume
is shared. It costs about ?27 per year. It uses a similar postfix
configuration as my main mail server, so it filters spam, viruses etc. It
is also possible to give it a list of valid email address, although I
haven't had the need to do that.
It was found through http://lowendbox.com/ which does have good deals
occasionally, if you get one before they sell out, I am not affiliated
with them in any way, except as one time customer.
openvz is not a great solution for SMTP, as things like fail2ban don't
work due to the shared nature of the kernel. Xen/KVM costs more, but is
more flexible for the kinds of stuff you want to do with SMTP.
--
Steve
> Hi All
>
> For about five months I have been running a small email server, which
> handles about a dozen messages a day. My "back-up server" is the
> simple email forwarding that came with the DNS account. Currently it is
> pointing at my ISP.
>
> However, some persistent spammer has discovered that my backup does not
> actually refuse *any* messages at all . . .
>
> So I am looking for an alternative that does an honest-to-goodness SMTP
> "bounce" on non-existent email addresses - and preferably will also
> handle DNS blacklists.
>
> I have a dynamic IP address - although it hasn't changed in over a year
> - so I feel I should have a backup of some sort.
>
> Can somebody recommend an (inexpensive) mail back-up service? Or any
> other ideas, short of building a second server and parking it in a
> friend's house?
>
> Allen C
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
------------------------------
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End of Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 5
***************************************
Selasa, 03 Februari 2015
Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 4
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2 (Fergus Allan)
2. Re: Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2 (Alex Butcher)
3. Backup email servers (Allen Coates)
4. Re: Backup email servers (Alex Butcher)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 13:23:31 -0000
From: "Fergus Allan" <f_w_allan@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
Message-ID: <029301d03fb4$9b33f0c0$d19bd240$@yahoo.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
SSD's have been incredibly unreliable. Either dirty pages returned or
complete failure.
I've had 2 crucial SSD's, both failed totally at 3 months old; little red
light comes on and no access to any part of the disk. The first also
returned dirty pages pretty much from day 1. I've haven't fixed all my
corrupted data from that issue. That was a few years ago. We were
discussing ordering some SSDs at work and I suggested Crucial even though I
don't trust their devices, expecting a positive reaction, but they shot
that down as too unreliable.
OCZ went bust and was bought out and the brand name retained. As far as I
can tell, OCZ makes crucial look good for reliability.
22 years? Not a chance. 3 maybe and back up often.
I'm toying with using SSD's again, but can't quite trust them unless I raid
them.
The SSD interface is a hard drive interface so can be directly substituted
for a hard drive and as a boot device. Performance wise, you need to be
aware of TRIM and of the block size. Whilst a modern operating system uses
a 4k block size, the minimum hardware block size in the SSD is 64k last time
I checked. This is why 4k random writes pan the performance.
In short, you want to make sure the disk tracks start on a 64k multiple to
get the best performance.
If not aligned correctly, if you OS is writing a cluster to borrow from
windows, you could write 8k of data that hits 2 different hardware blocks in
the device.
Fergus.
-----Original Message-----
From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk
[mailto:bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of
bristol-request@mailman.lug.org.uk
Sent: 02 February 2015 14:21
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than
"Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Boot using an SSD? (Mik Phelps)
2. Re: Boot using an SSD? (David Smith)
3. Re: Boot using an SSD? (Adrian Portway)
4. Re: Pi - SSH apt-get problem (Martin Habets)
5. Re: Boot using an SSD? (Alex Butcher)
6. Re: Boot using an SSD? (Shane McEwan)
7. Re: Boot using an SSD? (David Smith)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 12:15:18 +0000
From: Mik Phelps <ha1ry.g1t@mypostoffice.co.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID: <54CF6A56.1040600@mypostoffice.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hi all
I haven't posted on here for a while but I have been watching things
whenever I get a notification Email.
Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector, plus a
couple of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something about
this not being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier thread(s) on
here about this.
First OS to be openSUSE 13.2 64bit, deliberately not a 'bleeding edge'
Distro so that it's a bit more hardened rather than using the very latest
versions.
This completed Workstation is for the 'usual' daily office type things, some
Electronics and Loudspeaker Design related CAD plus remote control (GPIB and
Serial) of Electronics measurement/test Instruments on my bench with good
results viewing/comparisons amongst other things.
A possible second OS is still to be decided on, but may well be one of the
more specialised Linux 'Scientific Distros'.
So this is for a 'new build' PC with an i5-4690 processor, asus B65 Pro
Gamer Intel chipset Motherboard, 32GB DDR3 1333ram, Matrox dual head
Graphics Card with two Dell U2412M monitors to start with, The Asus MB is
because I need all three older type PCI expansion slots and Motherboards
with these type and number of expansion slots are getting really difficult
to find!
First Hard disk to be a fast R/W SSD, Samsung 850 EVO 120GB, with '/' type
partition for the OS plus a partition for 'swap', and then hopefully the
Boot Sector as well?
Second Hard disk for now , as I might add more for a software RAID setup
later, to be a WD, HDD RE4 500Gb, high reliability Server type, with the
entire disk to be partitioned for '/Home'.
Which is where my (first?) question arises about the Boot Sector please.
All parts have arrived where it is being assembled and tested together with
other necessary bits and bobs, such as two CD/DVD R/W drives, Etc to be
included in this build as well.
This is my last year's 65th Birthday and Christmas present to myself and if
it lasts as long as this
22+ year old Evesham Pentium 1 which I'm typing out this Post on, then
22+ it will both certainly 'see
me out' plus hopefully will give someone else some pleasure using it after
me :-) Anyway, much like me the Evesham is showing it's age with various
things beginning to fail with old age.
Thanks in advance for your valued assistance
yours
Mik
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 12:24:58 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888984B@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Mik Phelps
> Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector, plus
> a couple of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something
> about this not being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier
thread(s) on here about this.
I don't see why it should be difficult - my Asus Eee is SSD-only, and the OS
install is/was pretty easy.
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 12:41:13 +0000
From: Adrian Portway <adrian.portway@gmail.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID:
<CAAUR1PvXDp-7zWNjCzZJHFR6icTxdaiCe=OCHqMMdx6knNVq-A@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I second David's comment. I've been happily installing and booting SSD only
machines ( desktop and server ) for a while without any problems.
On Mon Feb 02 2015 at 12:25:37 David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com> wrote:
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Mik Phelps
> > Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector,
> > plus a
> couple
> > of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something about
> > this
> not
> > being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier thread(s) on
> > here
> about this.
>
> I don't see why it should be difficult - my Asus Eee is SSD-only, and
> the OS install is/was pretty easy.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 13:14:18 +0000
From: Martin Habets <errandir_news@mph.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Pi - SSH apt-get problem
Message-ID: <20150202131418.GB30434@mph.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Sun, Feb 01, 2015 at 12:29:59AM +0000, Peter Hemmings wrote:
> It was, I ended up removing the relevant files in
> "/var/lib/dpkg/info/" then re-installing them with apt-get install
> XXXXX --reinstall
>
> Also did a "clean" "autoremove" and "update" for good measure but
> maybe that was not necessary. All now OK have motion/camera working
> as well as ssh.
The "clean" will remove those files in /var/lib/dpkg/info/.
Good to see you've got it fixed.
Martin
> >Martin
> >
> >On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 05:26:40PM +0000, Peter Hemmings wrote:
> >>Hi,
> >>
> >>I have been playing with a pi "Noir Camera", it works OK on remote
> >>desktop with rdp but am having problems with sshing and getting
> >>apt-get to install programs.
> >>
> >>As this is not my normal distro, could someone help with how to
> >>resolve the errors?:
> >>
> >>
> >>The following packages will be REMOVED:
> >> ssh
> >>0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 1 to remove and 88 not upgraded.
> >>After this operation, 29.7 kB disk space will be freed.
> >>Do you want to continue [Y/n]? y
> >>dpkg: warning: files list file for package 'lxinput' missing;
> >>assuming package has no files currently installed
> >>dpkg: warning: files list file for package 'python-minimal' missing;
> >>assuming package has no files currently installed
> >>dpkg: unrecoverable fatal error, aborting:
> >> files list file for package 'poppler-utils' is missing final
> >>newline
> >>E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (2)
> >>pi@raspberrypi ~ $
> >>
> >>
> >>Thanks
> >>
> >>--
> >>Peter H
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Bristol mailing list
> >>Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> >>https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Bristol mailing list
> >Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> >https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
> >
>
> Regards
> --
> Peter H
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 14:06:07 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502021357080.21723@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Mon, 2 Feb 2015, Mik Phelps wrote:
> Hi all
> I haven't posted on here for a while but I have been watching things
> whenever I get a notification Email.
>
> Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector, plus
> a couple of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something
> about this not being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier
> thread(s) on here about this.
I can't conceive of any problems with that; SSDs just show up as standard
SATA devices. Remember to configure the BIOS to present them as AHCI before
installing your OS (especially Windows), though. Care to elaborate further
on what you'd heard?
[...]
> So this is for a 'new build' PC with an i5-4690 processor, asus B65
> Pro Gamer Intel chipset Motherboard, 32GB DDR3 1333ram, Matrox dual
> head Graphics Card with two Dell U2412M monitors to start with,
[...]
> First Hard disk to be a fast R/W SSD, Samsung 850 EVO 120GB, with '/'
> type partition for the OS plus a partition for 'swap', and then
> hopefully the Boot Sector as well?
With 32GB of RAM, a) you probably won't need swap and b) you don't want it
on your SSD as the number of writes will age it prematurely.
> Second Hard disk for now , as I might add more for a software RAID
> setup later, to be a WD, HDD RE4 500Gb, high reliability Server type,
> with the entire disk to be partitioned for '/Home'.
WD RAID Edition drives run with Time-Limited Error Recovery enabled by
default, so as to prevent a RAID controller from removing a drive from an
array because of a single failed block causing the drive to perform extended
(>7 seconds) recovery and seeming to the controller to be non-responsive.
TLER relies upon the RAID controller recovering the data from one or more
other drives in the array. If you're only using a single drive, then you
should disable TLER at the very least (but personally, I'd recommend getting
that other drive now and running it in a RAID array as it's designed to be
used).
Also, I'd recommend using LVM and creating a logical volume for /home,
starting at your current /home size plus 10%, say. Then, if you need more
space, extend the logical volume and resize the filesystem. That keeps space
available for other parts of the filesystem should you need it. Partitioning
isn't the most appropriate thing to do with modern, large discs.
> Which is where my (first?) question arises about the Boot Sector please.
What is your question?
> yours
> Mik
HTH,
Alex
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 14:11:09 +0000
From: Shane McEwan <shane@mcewan.id.au>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID: <54CF857D.4090209@mcewan.id.au>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
On 02/02/15 12:15, Mik Phelps wrote:
> Hi all
> I haven't posted on here for a while but I have been watching things
> whenever I get a notification Email.
Welcome back!
> Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector, plus
> a couple of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something
> about this not being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier
> thread(s) on here about this.
I can't think of any reason why you couldn't boot of an SSD. BIOS issues,
maybe, but any modern BIOS shouldn't have a problem. I have an Asus laptop
with only SSDs in it and it works fine.
The recommendation is that you turn on TRIM support for wear levelling of
the SSD. You either add the 'discard' option to your SSD mounts in
/etc/fstab (which can slow down file deletes on some SSDs) or add a cron job
that runs 'fstrim' occasionally (daily or weekly).
You should change your IO scheduler to 'noop' or 'deadline' for your SSD
device. The current scheduler is shown in brackets in
'/sys/block/<device>/queue/scheduler' and will probably be 'cfq'. I don't
know SUSE so I'm not sure how to change the scheduler permanently.
Somewhere in 'udev' I suspect. There should be tuning guides for SUSE on the
Internet somewhere.
> First Hard disk to be a fast R/W SSD, Samsung 850 EVO 120GB, with '/'
> type partition for the OS plus a partition for 'swap', and then
> hopefully the Boot Sector as well?
I'm inclined to recommend not bothering with swap. With 32GB of RAM you're
unlikely to start swapping unless you've got some seriously big software
running. The issue with swap on SSDs is that if you do start swapping you're
going to be doing a lot of writes to the SSD which reduces the life of it.
The reality is that modern SSDs are actually very reliable and last a long
time but if you really intend your PC to last 22 years then you're gonna
have to watch your writes to the SSD!
Also, the rule of thumb is to add as much swap as RAM but 32GB is a fair
chunk of your SSD. Do you really want to waste that space just for the
unlikely event of running out of RAM? If you really want swap on your SSD
then I'd recommend turning 'swappiness' down to a low value like '1'. That
will stop the kernel swapping out memory unless you're close to running out.
Have fun with your new toy!
Shane.
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 14:20:32 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F088898BC@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Shane McEwan I'm inclined to
> recommend not bothering with swap. With 32GB of RAM you're unlikely to
> start swapping unless you've got some seriously big software running.
> The issue with swap on SSDs is that if you do start swapping you're
> going to be doing a lot of writes to the SSD which reduces the life of
> it. The reality is that modern SSDs are actually very reliable and
> last a long time but if you really intend your PC to last 22 years
> then you're gonna have to watch your writes to the SSD!
Or stick the swap on the HDD. If you're trying to optimise the speed of the
PC by putting the swap on SSD rather than HDD then you're trying the solve
the wrong problem...
------------------------------
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https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
***************************************
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 14:56:16 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502031428510.14987@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Tue, 3 Feb 2015, Fergus Allan wrote:
> SSD's have been incredibly unreliable. Either dirty pages returned or
> complete failure.
>
> I've had 2 crucial SSD's, both failed totally at 3 months old; little red
> light comes on and no access to any part of the disk. The first also
> returned dirty pages pretty much from day 1. I've haven't fixed all my
> corrupted data from that issue. That was a few years ago. We were
> discussing ordering some SSDs at work and I suggested Crucial even though I
> don't trust their devices, expecting a positive reaction, but they shot
> that down as too unreliable.
But of course you've got backups you can restore from, right?!?
We make extensive use of SSDs in our centralised storage at work, with no
particular problems. But, of course, we'll almost certainly be using
enterprise kit rather than consumer stuff.
When choosing an SSD for a new desktop, amongst the consumer stuff, the
Samsung 850 PRO SSDs struck me as having appreciably better longevity
ratings (150TBW for the 128GB and 256GB models, 300TBW for the 512GB and
1TB) than most others and with a warranty (10 years) to match.
<http://www.storagereview.com/demystifying_ssd_endurance>
Personally, I still rely on (spinning rust) hard drives in RAID1 for storing
data that's at all important. The SSD is purely to improve responsiveness of
the OS and key applications, and it is backed up regularly to a RAID1 array
(or it will be, when I get round to it!)
> OCZ went bust and was bought out and the brand name retained. As far as I
> can tell, OCZ makes crucial look good for reliability.
>
> 22 years? Not a chance. 3 maybe and back up often.
That depends on the figure for maximum write volume (in TBW) and what your
write activity is like. For an SSD to last 22 years in a "normal
workstation" (<http://ssdendurancetest.com/>) requires specifying for
10-20GB/day of writes, or 80.3-160.6TBW. Only a dozen or so drives from the
two manufacturers you name are rated for over 100TBW:
<http://skinflint.co.uk/?cat=hdssd&xf=1035_OCZ~1035_Crucial~4930_100#xf_top>.
> I'm toying with using SSD's again, but can't quite trust them unless I raid
> them.
TBH, I haven't trusted un-mirrored HDDs since 2002.
> Fergus.
Best Regards,
Alex
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2015 16:59:31 +0000
From: Allen Coates <linux@cidercounty.org.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID: <54D0FE73.8010301@cidercounty.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hi All
For about five months I have been running a small email server, which
handles about a dozen messages a day. My "back-up server" is the
simple email forwarding that came with the DNS account. Currently it is
pointing at my ISP.
However, some persistent spammer has discovered that my backup does not
actually refuse *any* messages at all . . .
So I am looking for an alternative that does an honest-to-goodness SMTP
"bounce" on non-existent email addresses - and preferably will also
handle DNS blacklists.
I have a dynamic IP address - although it hasn't changed in over a year
- so I feel I should have a backup of some sort.
Can somebody recommend an (inexpensive) mail back-up service? Or any
other ideas, short of building a second server and parking it in a
friend's house?
Allen C
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 18:46:12 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502031841000.14987@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15"; Format="flowed"
On Tue, 3 Feb 2015, Allen Coates wrote:
> For about five months I have been running a small email server, which handles
> about a dozen messages a day. My "back-up server" is the simple email
> forwarding that came with the DNS account. Currently it is pointing at my
> ISP.
>
> However, some persistent spammer has discovered that my backup does not
> actually refuse *any* messages at all . . .
>
> So I am looking for an alternative that does an honest-to-goodness SMTP
> "bounce" on non-existent email addresses - and preferably will also handle
> DNS blacklists.
The ISP I use (Eclipse) provides SMTP mail delivery for ?4 per month (that
?4 also includes DNS registration and hosting and PHP-enabled webspace).
So the MX record for assursys.co.uk points at their MXs which merely do some
spam filtering then queue the messages for final delivery to my MTA,
whenever it's reachable (i.e. like how Demon Internet used to do it, in the
Good Old Days; presumably they have an internal-only MX record that points
to my MX). My own MX can then bounce messages using its own rules.
I don't know if they'll provide this service without you having a connection
with them, though.
Best Regards,
Alex
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 4
***************************************
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2 (Fergus Allan)
2. Re: Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2 (Alex Butcher)
3. Backup email servers (Allen Coates)
4. Re: Backup email servers (Alex Butcher)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 13:23:31 -0000
From: "Fergus Allan" <f_w_allan@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
Message-ID: <029301d03fb4$9b33f0c0$d19bd240$@yahoo.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
SSD's have been incredibly unreliable. Either dirty pages returned or
complete failure.
I've had 2 crucial SSD's, both failed totally at 3 months old; little red
light comes on and no access to any part of the disk. The first also
returned dirty pages pretty much from day 1. I've haven't fixed all my
corrupted data from that issue. That was a few years ago. We were
discussing ordering some SSDs at work and I suggested Crucial even though I
don't trust their devices, expecting a positive reaction, but they shot
that down as too unreliable.
OCZ went bust and was bought out and the brand name retained. As far as I
can tell, OCZ makes crucial look good for reliability.
22 years? Not a chance. 3 maybe and back up often.
I'm toying with using SSD's again, but can't quite trust them unless I raid
them.
The SSD interface is a hard drive interface so can be directly substituted
for a hard drive and as a boot device. Performance wise, you need to be
aware of TRIM and of the block size. Whilst a modern operating system uses
a 4k block size, the minimum hardware block size in the SSD is 64k last time
I checked. This is why 4k random writes pan the performance.
In short, you want to make sure the disk tracks start on a 64k multiple to
get the best performance.
If not aligned correctly, if you OS is writing a cluster to borrow from
windows, you could write 8k of data that hits 2 different hardware blocks in
the device.
Fergus.
-----Original Message-----
From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk
[mailto:bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of
bristol-request@mailman.lug.org.uk
Sent: 02 February 2015 14:21
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
Send Bristol mailing list submissions to
bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than
"Re: Contents of Bristol digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Boot using an SSD? (Mik Phelps)
2. Re: Boot using an SSD? (David Smith)
3. Re: Boot using an SSD? (Adrian Portway)
4. Re: Pi - SSH apt-get problem (Martin Habets)
5. Re: Boot using an SSD? (Alex Butcher)
6. Re: Boot using an SSD? (Shane McEwan)
7. Re: Boot using an SSD? (David Smith)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 12:15:18 +0000
From: Mik Phelps <ha1ry.g1t@mypostoffice.co.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID: <54CF6A56.1040600@mypostoffice.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hi all
I haven't posted on here for a while but I have been watching things
whenever I get a notification Email.
Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector, plus a
couple of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something about
this not being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier thread(s) on
here about this.
First OS to be openSUSE 13.2 64bit, deliberately not a 'bleeding edge'
Distro so that it's a bit more hardened rather than using the very latest
versions.
This completed Workstation is for the 'usual' daily office type things, some
Electronics and Loudspeaker Design related CAD plus remote control (GPIB and
Serial) of Electronics measurement/test Instruments on my bench with good
results viewing/comparisons amongst other things.
A possible second OS is still to be decided on, but may well be one of the
more specialised Linux 'Scientific Distros'.
So this is for a 'new build' PC with an i5-4690 processor, asus B65 Pro
Gamer Intel chipset Motherboard, 32GB DDR3 1333ram, Matrox dual head
Graphics Card with two Dell U2412M monitors to start with, The Asus MB is
because I need all three older type PCI expansion slots and Motherboards
with these type and number of expansion slots are getting really difficult
to find!
First Hard disk to be a fast R/W SSD, Samsung 850 EVO 120GB, with '/' type
partition for the OS plus a partition for 'swap', and then hopefully the
Boot Sector as well?
Second Hard disk for now , as I might add more for a software RAID setup
later, to be a WD, HDD RE4 500Gb, high reliability Server type, with the
entire disk to be partitioned for '/Home'.
Which is where my (first?) question arises about the Boot Sector please.
All parts have arrived where it is being assembled and tested together with
other necessary bits and bobs, such as two CD/DVD R/W drives, Etc to be
included in this build as well.
This is my last year's 65th Birthday and Christmas present to myself and if
it lasts as long as this
22+ year old Evesham Pentium 1 which I'm typing out this Post on, then
22+ it will both certainly 'see
me out' plus hopefully will give someone else some pleasure using it after
me :-) Anyway, much like me the Evesham is showing it's age with various
things beginning to fail with old age.
Thanks in advance for your valued assistance
yours
Mik
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 12:24:58 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F0888984B@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Mik Phelps
> Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector, plus
> a couple of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something
> about this not being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier
thread(s) on here about this.
I don't see why it should be difficult - my Asus Eee is SSD-only, and the OS
install is/was pretty easy.
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 12:41:13 +0000
From: Adrian Portway <adrian.portway@gmail.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID:
<CAAUR1PvXDp-7zWNjCzZJHFR6icTxdaiCe=OCHqMMdx6knNVq-A@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I second David's comment. I've been happily installing and booting SSD only
machines ( desktop and server ) for a while without any problems.
On Mon Feb 02 2015 at 12:25:37 David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com> wrote:
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Mik Phelps
> > Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector,
> > plus a
> couple
> > of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something about
> > this
> not
> > being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier thread(s) on
> > here
> about this.
>
> I don't see why it should be difficult - my Asus Eee is SSD-only, and
> the OS install is/was pretty easy.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
>
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 13:14:18 +0000
From: Martin Habets <errandir_news@mph.eclipse.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Pi - SSH apt-get problem
Message-ID: <20150202131418.GB30434@mph.eclipse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Sun, Feb 01, 2015 at 12:29:59AM +0000, Peter Hemmings wrote:
> It was, I ended up removing the relevant files in
> "/var/lib/dpkg/info/" then re-installing them with apt-get install
> XXXXX --reinstall
>
> Also did a "clean" "autoremove" and "update" for good measure but
> maybe that was not necessary. All now OK have motion/camera working
> as well as ssh.
The "clean" will remove those files in /var/lib/dpkg/info/.
Good to see you've got it fixed.
Martin
> >Martin
> >
> >On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 05:26:40PM +0000, Peter Hemmings wrote:
> >>Hi,
> >>
> >>I have been playing with a pi "Noir Camera", it works OK on remote
> >>desktop with rdp but am having problems with sshing and getting
> >>apt-get to install programs.
> >>
> >>As this is not my normal distro, could someone help with how to
> >>resolve the errors?:
> >>
> >>
> >>The following packages will be REMOVED:
> >> ssh
> >>0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 1 to remove and 88 not upgraded.
> >>After this operation, 29.7 kB disk space will be freed.
> >>Do you want to continue [Y/n]? y
> >>dpkg: warning: files list file for package 'lxinput' missing;
> >>assuming package has no files currently installed
> >>dpkg: warning: files list file for package 'python-minimal' missing;
> >>assuming package has no files currently installed
> >>dpkg: unrecoverable fatal error, aborting:
> >> files list file for package 'poppler-utils' is missing final
> >>newline
> >>E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (2)
> >>pi@raspberrypi ~ $
> >>
> >>
> >>Thanks
> >>
> >>--
> >>Peter H
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Bristol mailing list
> >>Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> >>https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Bristol mailing list
> >Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> >https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
> >
>
> Regards
> --
> Peter H
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bristol mailing list
> Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 14:06:07 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502021357080.21723@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Mon, 2 Feb 2015, Mik Phelps wrote:
> Hi all
> I haven't posted on here for a while but I have been watching things
> whenever I get a notification Email.
>
> Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector, plus
> a couple of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something
> about this not being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier
> thread(s) on here about this.
I can't conceive of any problems with that; SSDs just show up as standard
SATA devices. Remember to configure the BIOS to present them as AHCI before
installing your OS (especially Windows), though. Care to elaborate further
on what you'd heard?
[...]
> So this is for a 'new build' PC with an i5-4690 processor, asus B65
> Pro Gamer Intel chipset Motherboard, 32GB DDR3 1333ram, Matrox dual
> head Graphics Card with two Dell U2412M monitors to start with,
[...]
> First Hard disk to be a fast R/W SSD, Samsung 850 EVO 120GB, with '/'
> type partition for the OS plus a partition for 'swap', and then
> hopefully the Boot Sector as well?
With 32GB of RAM, a) you probably won't need swap and b) you don't want it
on your SSD as the number of writes will age it prematurely.
> Second Hard disk for now , as I might add more for a software RAID
> setup later, to be a WD, HDD RE4 500Gb, high reliability Server type,
> with the entire disk to be partitioned for '/Home'.
WD RAID Edition drives run with Time-Limited Error Recovery enabled by
default, so as to prevent a RAID controller from removing a drive from an
array because of a single failed block causing the drive to perform extended
(>7 seconds) recovery and seeming to the controller to be non-responsive.
TLER relies upon the RAID controller recovering the data from one or more
other drives in the array. If you're only using a single drive, then you
should disable TLER at the very least (but personally, I'd recommend getting
that other drive now and running it in a RAID array as it's designed to be
used).
Also, I'd recommend using LVM and creating a logical volume for /home,
starting at your current /home size plus 10%, say. Then, if you need more
space, extend the logical volume and resize the filesystem. That keeps space
available for other parts of the filesystem should you need it. Partitioning
isn't the most appropriate thing to do with modern, large discs.
> Which is where my (first?) question arises about the Boot Sector please.
What is your question?
> yours
> Mik
HTH,
Alex
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 14:11:09 +0000
From: Shane McEwan <shane@mcewan.id.au>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID: <54CF857D.4090209@mcewan.id.au>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
On 02/02/15 12:15, Mik Phelps wrote:
> Hi all
> I haven't posted on here for a while but I have been watching things
> whenever I get a notification Email.
Welcome back!
> Please can I ask for advice about having the Linux Boot Sector, plus
> a couple of other things, on an SSD drive, since I remember something
> about this not being necessarily easy but I can't find the earlier
> thread(s) on here about this.
I can't think of any reason why you couldn't boot of an SSD. BIOS issues,
maybe, but any modern BIOS shouldn't have a problem. I have an Asus laptop
with only SSDs in it and it works fine.
The recommendation is that you turn on TRIM support for wear levelling of
the SSD. You either add the 'discard' option to your SSD mounts in
/etc/fstab (which can slow down file deletes on some SSDs) or add a cron job
that runs 'fstrim' occasionally (daily or weekly).
You should change your IO scheduler to 'noop' or 'deadline' for your SSD
device. The current scheduler is shown in brackets in
'/sys/block/<device>/queue/scheduler' and will probably be 'cfq'. I don't
know SUSE so I'm not sure how to change the scheduler permanently.
Somewhere in 'udev' I suspect. There should be tuning guides for SUSE on the
Internet somewhere.
> First Hard disk to be a fast R/W SSD, Samsung 850 EVO 120GB, with '/'
> type partition for the OS plus a partition for 'swap', and then
> hopefully the Boot Sector as well?
I'm inclined to recommend not bothering with swap. With 32GB of RAM you're
unlikely to start swapping unless you've got some seriously big software
running. The issue with swap on SSDs is that if you do start swapping you're
going to be doing a lot of writes to the SSD which reduces the life of it.
The reality is that modern SSDs are actually very reliable and last a long
time but if you really intend your PC to last 22 years then you're gonna
have to watch your writes to the SSD!
Also, the rule of thumb is to add as much swap as RAM but 32GB is a fair
chunk of your SSD. Do you really want to waste that space just for the
unlikely event of running out of RAM? If you really want swap on your SSD
then I'd recommend turning 'swappiness' down to a low value like '1'. That
will stop the kernel swapping out memory unless you're close to running out.
Have fun with your new toy!
Shane.
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 14:20:32 +0000
From: David Smith <David.Smith@imgtec.com>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Boot using an SSD?
Message-ID:
<15A9D35B5490FC49AC0524AE3A085F088898BC@BRMAIL01.br.imgtec.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> From: bristol-bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk [mailto:bristol-
> bounces@mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Shane McEwan I'm inclined to
> recommend not bothering with swap. With 32GB of RAM you're unlikely to
> start swapping unless you've got some seriously big software running.
> The issue with swap on SSDs is that if you do start swapping you're
> going to be doing a lot of writes to the SSD which reduces the life of
> it. The reality is that modern SSDs are actually very reliable and
> last a long time but if you really intend your PC to last 22 years
> then you're gonna have to watch your writes to the SSD!
Or stick the swap on the HDD. If you're trying to optimise the speed of the
PC by putting the swap on SSD rather than HDD then you're trying the solve
the wrong problem...
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Bristol mailing list
Bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/bristol
End of Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
***************************************
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 14:56:16 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 2
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502031428510.14987@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Tue, 3 Feb 2015, Fergus Allan wrote:
> SSD's have been incredibly unreliable. Either dirty pages returned or
> complete failure.
>
> I've had 2 crucial SSD's, both failed totally at 3 months old; little red
> light comes on and no access to any part of the disk. The first also
> returned dirty pages pretty much from day 1. I've haven't fixed all my
> corrupted data from that issue. That was a few years ago. We were
> discussing ordering some SSDs at work and I suggested Crucial even though I
> don't trust their devices, expecting a positive reaction, but they shot
> that down as too unreliable.
But of course you've got backups you can restore from, right?!?
We make extensive use of SSDs in our centralised storage at work, with no
particular problems. But, of course, we'll almost certainly be using
enterprise kit rather than consumer stuff.
When choosing an SSD for a new desktop, amongst the consumer stuff, the
Samsung 850 PRO SSDs struck me as having appreciably better longevity
ratings (150TBW for the 128GB and 256GB models, 300TBW for the 512GB and
1TB) than most others and with a warranty (10 years) to match.
<http://www.storagereview.com/demystifying_ssd_endurance>
Personally, I still rely on (spinning rust) hard drives in RAID1 for storing
data that's at all important. The SSD is purely to improve responsiveness of
the OS and key applications, and it is backed up regularly to a RAID1 array
(or it will be, when I get round to it!)
> OCZ went bust and was bought out and the brand name retained. As far as I
> can tell, OCZ makes crucial look good for reliability.
>
> 22 years? Not a chance. 3 maybe and back up often.
That depends on the figure for maximum write volume (in TBW) and what your
write activity is like. For an SSD to last 22 years in a "normal
workstation" (<http://ssdendurancetest.com/>) requires specifying for
10-20GB/day of writes, or 80.3-160.6TBW. Only a dozen or so drives from the
two manufacturers you name are rated for over 100TBW:
<http://skinflint.co.uk/?cat=hdssd&xf=1035_OCZ~1035_Crucial~4930_100#xf_top>.
> I'm toying with using SSD's again, but can't quite trust them unless I raid
> them.
TBH, I haven't trusted un-mirrored HDDs since 2002.
> Fergus.
Best Regards,
Alex
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2015 16:59:31 +0000
From: Allen Coates <linux@cidercounty.org.uk>
To: bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk
Subject: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID: <54D0FE73.8010301@cidercounty.org.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hi All
For about five months I have been running a small email server, which
handles about a dozen messages a day. My "back-up server" is the
simple email forwarding that came with the DNS account. Currently it is
pointing at my ISP.
However, some persistent spammer has discovered that my backup does not
actually refuse *any* messages at all . . .
So I am looking for an alternative that does an honest-to-goodness SMTP
"bounce" on non-existent email addresses - and preferably will also
handle DNS blacklists.
I have a dynamic IP address - although it hasn't changed in over a year
- so I feel I should have a backup of some sort.
Can somebody recommend an (inexpensive) mail back-up service? Or any
other ideas, short of building a second server and parking it in a
friend's house?
Allen C
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 18:46:12 +0000 (GMT)
From: Alex Butcher <lug@assursys.co.uk>
To: Bristol and Bath Linux User Group <bristol@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [bristol] Backup email servers
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.11.1502031841000.14987@sbhezbfg.of5.nffheflf.cev>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15"; Format="flowed"
On Tue, 3 Feb 2015, Allen Coates wrote:
> For about five months I have been running a small email server, which handles
> about a dozen messages a day. My "back-up server" is the simple email
> forwarding that came with the DNS account. Currently it is pointing at my
> ISP.
>
> However, some persistent spammer has discovered that my backup does not
> actually refuse *any* messages at all . . .
>
> So I am looking for an alternative that does an honest-to-goodness SMTP
> "bounce" on non-existent email addresses - and preferably will also handle
> DNS blacklists.
The ISP I use (Eclipse) provides SMTP mail delivery for ?4 per month (that
?4 also includes DNS registration and hosting and PHP-enabled webspace).
So the MX record for assursys.co.uk points at their MXs which merely do some
spam filtering then queue the messages for final delivery to my MTA,
whenever it's reachable (i.e. like how Demon Internet used to do it, in the
Good Old Days; presumably they have an internal-only MX record that points
to my MX). My own MX can then bounce messages using its own rules.
I don't know if they'll provide this service without you having a connection
with them, though.
Best Regards,
Alex
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End of Bristol Digest, Vol 588, Issue 4
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